The dealer said I couldn't do it

[EWillers]

[ QUOTE ]
Interestingly enough the people who don't think the players should be allowed to do this only have one reason thats is because its the rule.


[/ QUOTE ]

True, this is the primary reason (and in my opinion the best argument) to disallow.

But also, what of the two players who "agree" to something and then there is a dispute as to what they actually agreed to.

What is the dealer/floor to do? Revert back to whatever "rules" the house may have? Throw said "rules" out the window and try to discern the new "rules" (the agreement) these two players have conjured?

I think in a perfect world it is the players' game. Ten years ago, any house runnin' a NL hold'em game would be foolish to disallow agreements between players. There were prolly < 1000 people in the world who played NL.

To continue to hold such a view in the modern era of poker is pollyannaish. The game needs rules (even in the higher--maybe not the highest--but at least the highER limits) to coordinate the massive influx of new, inexperienced, and oh so blessed players.

[NoGimmicks]

As a dealer I would just call the floor and let them make the call but I know one thing if it was a raked game and pushed it to a higher limit the full rake would be taken.

[UbinTook]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The dealer is there to manage the game

[/ QUOTE ]

No he isn't. He is there to deal the cards. What is he going to do, physically restrain the players from doing what they want with their money? There is always a casino down the street that has dealers that understand they need to stay out of the game.

[/ QUOTE ]
No, but i promise you that if players are doing something that is either
A. a blatant disregard of a rule(s), or
B. will affect MY Job( because i didn't enforce something i should have)
I will clarify the rule, if they ignore me or refuse to follow the rule(s) the game will stop until the situation is rectified by the floor.

[ QUOTE ]

edit to add: In most higher limit games if a dealer complains "a player told me to STFU" they will generally be told away form the table to talk less (or none at all). There are games where the dealer literally has nothing to say, ever.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not at Casino Arizona, i agree that in fact many times the less said by the dealer the better, but abuse just isn't tolerated.

[Gonso]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The dealer is there to manage the game

[/ QUOTE ]

No he isn't. He is there to deal the cards. What is he going to do, physically restrain the players from doing what they want with their money? There is always a casino down the street that has dealers that understand they need to stay out of the game.

edit to add: In most higher limit games if a dealer complains "a player told me to STFU" they will generally be told away form the table to talk less (or none at all). There are games where the dealer literally has nothing to say, ever.


[/ QUOTE ]

For players with no live experience other than very low limit games, this probably seems a little retarded, but it's kind of how it is. Dealers run 1/2 games for the most part because they need to be managed, but this isn't the case with a lot of higher limit games. Those guys don't really need anyone to manage their game, and they don't want anyone to manage their game. All they really want is a warm body to deal the cards.

STFU is pretty much the order of the day in those games if you're a dealer in the bigger markets. I can speak to AC and Vegas, and I'm sure CA isn't any different since I hear they're the worst as far as dealer abuse. The whole point is that it's their money and their game.

And if there is a problem, well that's what the floor is for.

[RR]

[ QUOTE ]
Not at Casino Arizona, i agree that in fact many times the less said by the dealer the better, but abuse just isn't tolerated.

[/ QUOTE ]

They don't have really big games there because there is a limit to what can be bet. Also back in about 2000 when complaints about abuse were a big topic a good friend of mine spoke about dealers abusing players at some poker industry conference. Dealers talking and getting in the player's business is the worst form of abuse.