i'm a huge calling station

[thepizzlefosho]

capping pf is good, although I certainly don't think there is anything too wrong with just calling. You probably only have a slight equity edge 3-way, and I don't think you are giving up too much by not pushing it.

I like how you played it postflop. If I didn't cap pf I would probably just c/c down as you did. If I capped pre I probably b/c the flop and call down because I tend to be suspicious of guys playing 60/30 even 5-handed.

[frenchpignouf]

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Also a small, non-zero chance he folds AA.

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[img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] misclick ?

[TheHip41]

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b/f river maybe? I like that line. He's not raising you with < trips, and he probably isn't vbetting JJ, but might call. Also a small, non-zero chance he folds AA.

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I like your thought process about betting to get $$$ when you are ahead, but, no one has ever folded AA in their life here. It's just not going to happen

[jr4284]

Right, i'm not expecting them to fold it, but there is a very finite (minute) chance they will. B/f'ing merely: a) prevents us from having to overcall the river (which is my only real problem with this hand) and b) commits the same ammount of money to the pot. People also tend to pay me off on the river with 2nd pair and worse after seeing me bet this river.

Edited for miles' satisfaction

[milesdyson]

did you mean minute instead of finite? saying "very finite" is weird.

and the % is so close to zero it doesn't strengthen the argument for betting.

[thepizzlefosho]

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Right, i'm not expecting them to fold it, but there is a very finite chance they will. B/f'ing merely: a) prevents us from having to overcall the river (which is my only real problem with this hand) and b) commits the same ammount of money to the pot. People also tend to pay me off on the river with 2nd pair and worse after seeing me bet this river.

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why are we worried about overcalling? what can the BB have here that ever beats us? The fact that he CC two in the BB likely tells me that he is horrible, and if he had a K he would 100% have raised at some point in the hand. This overcall makes us money because this guy is calling down with J9 or TT or something and we are more likely to win 2BB on the river by getting him to SD his crap than we are by donking out and getting 2 calls.

[RudeboyOi]

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[ QUOTE ]
Right, i'm not expecting them to fold it, but there is a very finite chance they will. B/f'ing merely: a) prevents us from having to overcall the river (which is my only real problem with this hand) and b) commits the same ammount of money to the pot. People also tend to pay me off on the river with 2nd pair and worse after seeing me bet this river.

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why are we worried about overcalling? what can the BB have here that ever beats us? The fact that he CC two in the BB likely tells me that he is horrible, and if he had a K he would 100% have raised at some point in the hand. This overcall makes us money because this guy is calling down with J9 or TT or something and we are more likely to win 2BB on the river by getting him to SD his crap than we are by donking out and getting 2 calls.

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this is exactly why donking the river is bad
we dont want bb to fold but with
us acting behind him he will be more likely to call
with a weaker pair unsure if we'll even call
but if we decided to fire out on the river
we may convince him to now fold his weaker pair

[vmacosta]

rzk,
i think you can set up your HUD to display AP (average players). Then the stats are easy to interpret.

As for the hand, you lose here a lot but this is def the best way to play it imo. Everything is standard (with possible exception of pf, but we need more precise stats to make that decision) until the river.

As for the river, RE: the button, this is a rare case where if you donk you can expect to be called with just about the same range that will bet when checked to.

RE: the BB, i suspect he is somewhat more likely to call a river bet with a weak hand (hoping to catch a dumb bluff?) if button bets. If you donk he'll be feeling a little caught in the midddle and may dump an extra hand or two.

[rzk]

just for kicks, bb won the hand with KJo, button had KTo.

btw, i think it's good to sometimes post what the villain(s) had after people discuss the hand, provided that:

1. there's no selection bias, i.e. you would have posted the hand regardless of what the villain(s) had.

2. people here are mature enough as poker players to understand that if there is an argument about the best move, revealing a specific hand doesn't lend more support to either side.

[inferno]

you have to becarefull with overcalling in these spots I have it often enough that the board has a overcard to my pair and one dude is just calling all the way, I started folding rivers like that and it saves me monies