JJ Call flop shove?

[KCrow]

Villain is 22/11/3.9

I've been reasonably aggressive on this table but not had to show any hands.

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $40.85
BB: $124.90
Hero (UTG): $63.10
MP: $33.00
CO: $74.45
BTN: $44.00

Preflop: Hero is dealt J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (6 Players)
<font color="red">Hero raises to $2.00</font>, 3 folds, SB calls $1.75, BB folds

Flop: ($4.50) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">SB bets $4.50</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $12.00</font>, <font color="red">SB raises all-in to $38.85</font>, [i]Hero?

[CmnDwnWrkn]

Without any reads other than he is aggressive, I would fold here. With two fives on the board, I don't think he is shoving without a very big hand that beats yours. And if he is shoving against a raise on a paired board as a total bluff, then he is very wreckless and you will make this back plus interest against him later

[LethargicMule]

looks like a fold without a read on how he plays his big pairs. otherwise he could play a smaller overpair this way if he is a donk. does he always 3 bet his big overpairs? if so i think this is a call.

[LethargicMule]

when you have so much invested already its tought o fold this hand.

[dnord]

I guess you're mostly hoping that he's pushing 66/77/99/TT, and not that he's pushing AA/KK/QQ, but I think he probably would have 3-bet AA/KK, so maybe I believe he's holding a worse pocket pair than you. 88 is what he's representing by doing this, and I just don't think I believe it.

I'm having a very hard time imagining unpaired cards he would play like this. I think it might be 40% random 8s, 30% misplayed 5s, and 30% misguided Ax bluffs.

[orig!naL]

this is really tough, but I think it's a fold. I really don't see him having 88; I doubt he would play the nuts that way. Given that you're only hope is he has 99 or TT. This looks like a huge pocket pair to me, one that for whatever reason he didn't 3-bet pre-flop.

[retleftolc]

Grunch

SB calls our raise saying- I got a little something.

SB Donks saying- Am I good? or I am good!!

You raise saying- Hey, I don't just have AK here!

He <u>Pushes</u> saying- I don't care, I don't want your information.

What hand do we put him on through out the hand? A5s, 56s, 9's, T's, J's, and QQ. Through in a AQ and for good measure.

More importantly, what is his all-in range? Throw out 9's - J's. Its not AQ. Maybe QQ. But what do we beat?

Fold.

What could have been done differently?

Preflop good.

Flop-

He just didn't donk- He bet the pot. He is 22/11 so he's probably not out of line. Our alternate choices are call or fold. Can't really find a fold here. Maybe call and fold to turn aggression. If we call, he is committed with his next bet.

I probably play it the same way you did at the table.

Ret

[Lego05]

I'd probably just call his original flop bet.

[Rant]

I call on the flop. His stats aren't bad so he's maybe not a donk. The turn will tell us a lot more.

The flop raise is either:
1) Value raise - I'm too nervous to value raise here against a raise call and a big flop bet. He's more likely to have AA-QQ or x5 than 67, x8.

2) An attempt to get him to fold - I don't see the point in getting him to fold. He isn't likely on a draw. If he's ahead of us then we're giving him our $. If he's behind then he's going to fold and we'd be better off getting something out of him on the turn and the river.

[IlliniDave]

I'd call the flop and see what he does on the turn; not really committed AI with the board that way and him betting the pot which is telling us villain has something.