Call I had to make not 20 minutes ago

[OK-Poker]

Man I'm just starting to cool down and I'm about 100% sure I made the wrong call however I am comfortable with it.

Let me lay out the situation. 5/10 NL 4 handed games 1 drunk away from busting. The drunk has probably never played in a cash game before. 10 minute after setting down with 200 he asked when the blinds go up. He proceeds to donk out on people and get about 700 winner.

Hand in question comes up, Drunk limps BB (Regular friendly customer) raises 30 Drunk calls.

Flop Ah 5c 2c

Drunk Checks, regular bets 30.
Drunk check raises to 60
Regular makes it 220.
Drunk calls.

All the regular player has left at this point is a 100 dollar bill (Cash plays) and 4 white chips.

The problem now is that the dealer does not see the 100 bill and deals out the turn and river. The regular player turns his hand over and then realizes he wasn't all in and quickly turns it back over. This is when I'm called over.

I basicly assume it as a burn and turn to soon and tell them that a cards coming back. Drunk starts yelling that he should get his 220 back that he put in on the flop, and that both the turn and river come back. I tell him that it is absolutely not going to happen. He proceeds to call me a [censored] piece of cheating [censored] and everything else yada yada yada.

I might add that I did not know what the regular player had shown.

Heres where my mistake came in, I kept the original river card and replaced the turn card. I got this drunk yelling and cussing in my ear and I make a mistake. I tell them to act on the original river card as the turn card and the drunk says [censored] it I'm all in. The regular player says call and sticks the money out there. The drunk player turns over AQ and the regular player does not table his hand yet. Rivers a Queen of diamonds and I honestly thought the drunk won the pot with Aces up(thought this was going to shut him up) However the original river card happened to be a club giving the regular player the nut Flush.

This is when security was brought in to seperate me and said player etc.

Why am I comfortable? If the [censored] would of shut up I would of made the correct decision.

Also the guys ONLY argument was that he thought both the turn and river cards should come back.

His argument was also not based on seeing the players hand as he also thought he had won with the Q hit giving him aces up.


Sorry if this is all garbled but feel free to chime in.

I did however almost want to say "no [censored] you" when the regular turned over the nuts.

[RR]

[ QUOTE ]
Heres where my mistake came in, I kept the original river card and replaced the turn card. I got this drunk yelling and cussing in my ear and I make a mistake. I tell them to act on the original river card as the turn card and the drunk says [censored] it I'm all in. The regular player says call and sticks the money out there. The drunk player turns over AQ and the regular player does not table his hand yet. Rivers a Queen of diamonds and I honestly thought the drunk won the pot with Aces up(thought this was going to shut him up) However the original river card happened to be a club giving the regular player the nut Flush.


[/ QUOTE ]

Well you know yo made a mistake and it can't be undone. I would add that this sort of fundemental error should not be happening; the floor is suppsoed to be able to sor tthrough all the yelling and confusion that comes with this sort of situation.

[grando]

you brought back the turn but left the river out there? what?

if you're telling the story correctly, I'd be so pissed off if I was the drunk guy

[OK-Poker]

That's what ended up happening and as soon as the situation calmed down I realized the wrong card came back.

The drunk is very pissed. However he's pissed because he wants both cards to come back. The fact that the wrong card was brought back was never the issue.

The ONLY people that realize what went wrong here are me and 2+2.

Player thinks he should get to pull his 220 back that he put in on the flop, start over at the flop and deal a new turn and river. And I'm a [censored] ass hole because I won't let it happen.

[OK-Poker]

I agree however it's not the first mistake I've ever made and won't be the last and I'm ok with that. In the 4 years I've been a floor manager I think my track records been pretty good.

[RR]

[ QUOTE ]
The ONLY people that realize what went wrong here are me and 2+2.


[/ QUOTE ]

There is another mistake in there. Afte ryou make a decision you should leave the table so if someone wants to argue they have to leave the table and go someplace else to talk about it.

[OK-Poker]

I did leave the table however my podium is at the front of a small 6 table enclosed room. Wasn't too much I could do to avoid it.

Also the 2 other players at the table left while I was trying to get the story and make my decision

[grando]

so you're saying that the regular flipped up his cards, showed the drunk guy that he had the nut flush with the river card that's actually the turn card, and the drunk guy pushed all in with 1 pair knowing he was drawing dead?!?

[Leibniz]

If I were to make the decision, I would rule that the current burn cards should remain down, the incorrectly dealt turn and river cards should be placed back into the deck, the deck shuffled, and then a new turn and river card be dealt without burning any cards in between.

I would say this, based on my interpretation of Robert's Rules, Section 5:

"8. A dealing error for the fourth boardcard is rectified in a manner to least influence the identity of the boardcards that would have been used without the error. The dealer burns and deals what would have been the fifth card in the fourth card's place. After this round of betting, the dealer reshuffles the deck, including the card that was taken out of play, but not including the burncards or discards. The dealer then cuts the deck and deals the final card without burning a card. If the fifth card is turned up prematurely, the deck is reshuffled and dealt in the same manner."

Since this is similar in scope to only a single card being burned and turned incorrectly, and the burn cards that are down would have been the correct burn cards anyway, I feel my solution would be the fairest decision.

As for being a floor person and not knowing what decision to make I should like to offer this critique. Although, as you say, during the years you have worked you have make good decisions most of the time; and barring that unusual circumstances do come up in card games, I believe that it is unacceptable that a floor person would make a decision as you did.

First, it should be yours and every other floor person's (and dealer's for that matter) responsibility to know Robert's Rules for Poker by heart. I don't feel the amount of information contained within it is too much for anyone to learn, especially if that is their primary duty. I've had jobs in which I am expected to know, within an instant, information that makes the amount contained in RR look trivial. At the very least, I don't understand why a writen copy isn't kept at every poker kiosk as a reference. The one thing I've taken from college and the "real" world is that, if you are unsure of the answer to a question, go and find out what the correct one is (from a book or another person) before answering.

Second, I believe your emotional engagement in the situation led to you making a bad decision. Now, I say this as a person who has 12 years of customer service experience, in everything from retail to collections, so I understand completely the feelings and emotions that a person goes through during a heated or difficult exchange, especially with someone who is drunk. But, as a manager, it is your duty, and should have been one of your qualifications, to always handle decisions like these with a calm and collected demeanor. Not only does that help you make a good decision, but it also represents the company you work for well and sets a good example for others. To say you made a bad decision based on the fact a yelling customer was putting pressure on you would lead me to ask the question, "Is this the job for you?" Now, I'm not making a judgement about that one way or another. Only you can decide that for yourself. But if part of your job consists of dealing with difficult people, and that makes you uncomfortable enough to have lapses in judgement, then I would seriously re-evaluate my career choice, if it were me, or learn how to better deal with my emotional reaction in such circumstances.

I hope you take what I have said with an open mind, even if it is at first a bitter pill to swallow. I have tried to be thoughtful in my reply and spent a significant amount of time writing it. Best of luck to you in the future.

[RR]

[ QUOTE ]
the incorrectly dealt turn and river cards should be placed back into the deck, the deck shuffled, and then a new turn and river card be dealt without burning any cards in between.

[/ QUOTE ]

The only card that dealt prematurely was the river.