Building a bankroll (for newbies) revisited.

[thirteen]

I'd like to offer newbies some advice on building they're beginner bankroll.

I've read Homer's original Building a bankroll (For Newbies). It's a good read, but I feel its a bit outdated. Some of the bonuses listed as a place to start, such as interpoker, are very tough to clear at the low stakes, and since there are no micro stakes NL games here, the risk of ruin for a NL player is high. Other bonuses, such as William Hill's pay to play (where you get a bonus for 5 hours of play), is currently only available to .50/1.00 stakes players according to their site. So its no help to newbies anymore.

I started with a very small bankroll of $50 and through decent play and some bonuses I was able to grow it significantly.

Start at Pacific Poker.

The reason is that they will give you the bonus money up front in your account as soon as you make your deposit. So, a typical starter bankroll of $100 will become $125 and you can play with that money right away. You must wager 20x the bonus amount to cash out the bonus money but this is fairly easy even playing NL $10.

Also, I'd HIGHLY recommend finding a current pacific player to refer you to the site before signing up. You'll get an additional $25 deposited in your account. This extra $25 was very helpful to me since I was playing with such a small original deposit. If you don't know anyone personally that plays there, then find someone in the forum who does and PM them. Most people will be happy to refer you because they also get a bonus. Again, this bonus is cleared by wagering 20x the amount.

I cleared both bonuses in 4 weeks playing NL $10.

Another reason to play at Pacific poker is that it's known for having very fishy small stakes games. NL 10 and NL 25 regularly have tables with 50% - 60% of the players seeing the flop in full 10 handed ring. Play tight ABC poker and you'll make money here.


Next step...

Party Poker... now I know that Homer says in his original post that it's horrible to recommend Party Poker to newbies. However if you sign up through an affiliate called Instant Bankroll(instantbankroll.com) you have two very attractive bonus options... Option requires no deposit to receive $100 free to play with (you actually get $75 up front from the affiliate to play with and will get the remaining $25 from party after clearing the bonus). Option two is to deposit $50 or more of your own money and after clearing the bonus, you'll get $100 from the affiliate and $25 from Party Poker.

I chose the second option because the bonus clearing requirements are the same, and I was rolled to play NL $25 where I knew I could clear the bonus quickly. The requirements to clear are simply play 500 raked hands, that's it. It does not matter how much rake is taken. If the hand is raked it counts. I 4 tabled NL $25 and cleared the bonus in two nights with only 5 hours of play. I was properly rolled for and comfortable playing NL $25 at this time, if you are not, please play the smaller limits. Party offers smaller stakes in both limit and NL so play where you are comfortable even it if takes a little longer to clear.

Party Poker micro stakes are full of inexperienced players. Play ABC poker and you should be able to make money while clearing your bonus.


Next step...

My next step was interpoker, but like i said this bonus is slow to clear at NL $25, plus it seems that because its primarily a european site the majority of the traffic is during the day and tapers off during primetime US hours. A good thing about interpoker is that rakeback is readily available from a number of affiliates.

A good option may be Absolute poker. I have not played there yet but they have a 200% sign up bonus running and it is released in $10 increments which is very useful to players building their bankroll.

Also, Games Grid(gamesgrid.com), which is very new, is offering 1000% (thats not a typo) sign up bonus that is also released incrementally. You have an entire year from sign up in order to clear it. However, traffic is very low. I downloaded the software(though I have not deposited) and usually only one or two tables of NL $10 is running.


If anyone has anything to add, or any questions, let me know. I hope this is useful to some starting players.

[jb9]

Rakeback.

[thirteen]

[ QUOTE ]
Rakeback.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good point. I didn't really talk about it but rakeback is a must for any ring game player. It's readily available for most sites. I'm very glad to have rakeback at interpoker.

As for the two main sites I discussed... I don't believe you can get rakeback at pacific, but newbies should search to know for sure.

I know party rakeback is a touchy subject. I'll simply say that you cannot get rakeback with the instant bankroll bonus that I list. So if you plan on using that site then don't wast time trying to search for it.

Rakeback is available for the two other sites I mention, interpoker and absolute. So if you sign up at either make sure you go through an affiliate offering rakeback. Go to the rakeback forum here on 2+2 to find one.

[3CardMonty]

[ QUOTE ]

I know party rakeback is a touchy subject. I'll simply say that you cannot get rakeback with the instant bankroll bonus that I list. So if you plan on using that site then don't wast time trying to search for it.


[/ QUOTE ]

Rakeback is not allowed at Party Poker. This means even if you sign up with a site offering a Party Poker rake rebate you still stand the chance of having it cut off if Party discovers the affiliate is making that deal.

As for Instant Bankroll (IB) it is surprisingly not mentioned much in this forum. [img]/images/graemlins/ooo.gif[/img]

IB is one of the best ways a beginner can obtain and build a nice bank from the git go without risking anything. 100% + EV, there is no way it can drop below ZERO invested if you go with the no deposit offer.

The best IB deal is no doubt the one requiring a deposit of $50.00 where you can play the 500 raked hands and come out $125.00 + your initial $50.00 or $175.00 assuming even play through the 500 hands.

For those who might not have $50.00 to gamble with and want to get a bank started the no deposit deal is certainly good.

Maybe it's not discussed here because many new players will enter the beginner rooms which expire to all new players in 45 days of deposit and therefore not be available to the more seasoned players. I really should say I don't know the real reason, please forgive me. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

The best part of the IB deal is players can take advantage of it even if they allready have a Party Poker play chip account. This is allowed and explained in the sign up instructions.

That's my 2 cents worth and personally I think it is excellent advice for anyone wanting to get a bank started. Even if I can't get into the beginner room and try to take that cash on the spot. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] It certainly goes well beyond the deals offered otherwise by Party Poker or anyone else I know of unless you sign up through another player and maybe split that players new player signup stack of chippies somehow.

Moving on...
Since Party Poker and Empire Poker split players can now sign up for accounts on both of the sites. Empire has fewer players but again in the beginner rooms (just like party) the rake is easy to make and the hands are a snap to clear.

Empire is now the site where you want to use the older Party Poker advice (previous bankroll threads) and wait to deposit the maximum amount so you can clear the entire bonus $100.00 which clears at 5X bonus in raked hands (500 raked hands for the $100.00 bonus). There are also some software offerings associated with Empire like Poker Office and you can still get the entire Empire bonus as well (better deal).

In addition it is noted that Empire recently offered a substantial bonus for re-deposit recently (Jan. 1) and I hope they will be doing this again. My own opinion is it is likely as they want to build the customer base right now.

Add Empire to the list of nice bonuses, free software (for now), soft games, and easy rake requirements. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Final thought...
If you don't qualify for the IB Party Poker deal you might qualify for the NEW Titan Poker IB deal. Not as easy to clear but hey it is free money so again 100% +EV.

I may have a bad heart (literaly see my problem ) but at least I still have one for the new guys! [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Monty

[Quicksilvre]

[ QUOTE ]
IB is one of the best ways a beginner can obtain and build a nice bank from the git go without risking anything. 100% + EV, there is no way it can drop below ZERO invested if you go with the no deposit offer.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree 100%, IB is fantastic. Unfortunately for me, I have the bankroll sense of a watermelon, so when I got the $125 bonus, I cashed most of it out so I could show an immediate profit in my bank account. That resulted in me being chronically underrolled until I went BUSTO last week. I was able to make a total of $195 on my $50, but taking the cash out was definately a bad idea.

[Seven247]

Quick question...

Are the 500 raked hands, the hands that you win or just 500 raked hands at the table, hands you put money in but lost, etc?

[Lawman]

Forget Absolute: the bonus requirement has changed so that only hands raked at least $0.50 count. So anything below $2/4 (limit) will take forever to clear. Not sure what the implications are for NL but definitely not as juicy as before.

You might also want to check out Mr Wookie's recent post which updated Homer's original (someone else might care to post a link).

[thirteen]

[ QUOTE ]
Forget Absolute: the bonus requirement has changed so that only hands raked at least $0.50 count. So anything below $2/4 (limit) will take forever to clear. Not sure what the implications are for NL but definitely not as juicy as before.

You might also want to check out Mr Wookie's recent post which updated Homer's original (someone else might care to post a link).

[/ QUOTE ]


Thanks for the tips Lawman.

For those that haven't seen it, below is a link to MrWookie's post that Lawman mentioned. He goes into more detail on rake back offers. He also makes some suggestions on where to play micro-limit games.

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showfl...part=1&vc=1

[AKQJ10]

[ QUOTE ]
Forget Absolute: the bonus requirement has changed so that only hands raked at least $0.50 count.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm clearing at $1/2 (single tabling no less!), but (EDIT) apparently you're right. Have they increased their rake, so that hands that would have barely triggered the bonus in the past are now triggering the bonus at the higher rake?

At any rate, if I can't clear bonuses at Absolute then there's no reason to play there. The games are too tough for the respective limits, compared to other sites.

[pzhon]

I don't recommend GamesGrid for those who are relatively new to poker. 1000% sounds great, except that the bonus clears so slowly that you could clear much more at other sites, and the games are tougher than on many other sites. I think I cleared about $20 of the $5000, so I would have gotten the same out of a 5% bonus.

InterPoker's bonus is actually fine for new players. Each pot reaching $5 clears $0.05, and you can clear this bonus at the soft $0.25-$0.50 and NL $25 tables, albeit slowly. Every pot reaching $20 clears $0.20. Several other Cryptologic bonuses are scaled versions of InterPoker's, except that you have to clear the entire bonus within the month. On InterPoker, you can wait for one of the promotions that pays $10 for KK (or AA today), worth another 4.5 cents per hand. You have to play at least $0.50-$1 or NL $50 today.

There are three Cyptologic sites with much easier bonuses to clear than InterPoker's. William Hill, UK Betting, and TotalBet pay GBP 5 for each of the first 5 table-hours each month. That's a great deal! You have to play at least 1-2 limit or NL 100.

Bet365 (Prima network) has a nice initial deposit bonus, and they have been running a 5x bonus up to $100 in the past few months. The initial deposit bonus can be cleared at lower limits, but the monthly bonuses have to be at $1-$2 or NL $100 or higher.

Several Boss Media network skins have easy initial bonuses to clear and very soft games.

Bodog can be a good place to clear bonuses for beginners. They have an unlimited 10% deposit bonus, soft low stakes games, and you can clear the bonus by playing tournaments, getting a 100% rebate on tournament entry fees.

I recommend avoiding Full Tilt (bonus sounds great, but is slow to clear) and PokerRoom skins (high rake, slow clearance).

For more information, see the Internet Bonuses forum, www.bonuswhores.com , or the forums of www.onlineblackjackguide.com .