Best Bet for Abstract Intelligence Development in Other Orders

Jcrew · #1 03-25-2007, 12:01 PM

If we eliminated the primate order from Earth, which other order would have the best shot of developing abstract intelligence similar to humans?

Edit:
Follow up question: Suppose in the future we discover the GUT and are able to build a perfect simulator of Earth. If the simulator is unable to develop beings of abstract thinking within its program from first principles, does this increase the likelihood of the theist's point of view?

LCposter · #2 03-25-2007, 05:15 PM

By some measures, dolphins are considered more intelligent than primates. For example, I've read that other than humans, dolphins are the only other species known to engage in gang rape. Not the most pleasing example, to be sure, but it does demonstrate a sophisticated sense of social intelligence (team goal acquisition, communication, cooperation, etc).

Follow-up question: Yes, I think it does increase the likelihood of the theist perspective, but I think the simulation might need to iterate through countless numbers of initial "seed" configurations before we could conclude that the likelihood of intelligence resulting from chance is neglibly small.

Piers · #3 03-25-2007, 05:52 PM

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If we eliminated the primate order from Earth, which other order would have the best shot of developing abstract intelligence similar to humans?

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Assuming you are not implying technological, I would guess dolphins have the highest level of abstract intelligence outside the primates.

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Suppose in the future we discover the GUT

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Eh! What’s GUT? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

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are able to build a perfect simulator of Earth. If the simulator is unable to develop beings of abstract thinking within its program from first principles, does this increase the likelihood of the theist's point of view?

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No. It would just mean we have not in fact build a perfect simulator, or we need to run the simulator though a few more times. In fact this could be considered a test to see if we have created a perfect simulator, making the question logically precarious.

Sephus · #4 03-25-2007, 06:08 PM

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Eh! What’s GUT? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

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theory of everything.

edit: according to link, i should have said "theory of almost everything."

Kimbell175113 · #5 03-25-2007, 06:08 PM

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Eh! What’s GUT? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

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Grand Unified Theory

Subfallen · #6 03-25-2007, 07:40 PM

We'll hardly need a GUT to develop AI exceeding human intelligence ("strong" AI.) That will be here within the next 30 years, assuming mankind doesn't self-destruct.

Once humans have created strong AI, it will go a long way towards demystifying most of what's supposedly "supernatural" about human consciousness.

Brainwalter · #7 03-25-2007, 08:32 PM

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We'll hardly need a GUT to develop AI exceeding human intelligence ("strong" AI.) That will be here within the next 30 years, assuming mankind doesn't self-destruct.

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Source?

Piers · #8 03-25-2007, 09:26 PM

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Grand Unified Theory

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Ah! Of course!

However I do not think the Grand Unified Theory is needed. The process whereby life developed was I suspect largely chemical. So to simulate the generation of life, it might only be necessary to model the earth at a chemical level, much simpler than the sub-nuclear level and hence maybe even possible at some later date.

DMACM · #9 03-25-2007, 11:24 PM

Its true that if u take the brain weight as a percentage of body weight dolphins come in 2nd to humans with chimpanzees being 3rd.

There is also anecdotal evidence of their intelligence. I think what seperated out humans as developing abstract intelligence is the fact that when humans became bipeds from quadrapeds their arms were very convenient for tool use. Its tough to predict where else that would have occured.

Its really our technology that is changing our lives so fast. A city-dweller in an industrialized nation leads a vastly different life then a hunter gatherer with little or no genetic difference.

DMACM · #10 03-25-2007, 11:26 PM

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We'll hardly need a GUT to develop AI exceeding human intelligence ("strong" AI.) That will be here within the next 30 years, assuming mankind doesn't self-destruct.

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Source?

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I think the best author's on this theory are Ray Kurzweil and Hans Moravec. Its based on extrapolation of current technological trends.