Full Ring 101 Questions - N00Bs ask here

[MrBump]

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I've seen a few posts where people are using Aggression Factor when assesing what a 'donkbet' means (She has a high aggression factor so a donkbet doesn't mean much, for example)

That's the incorrect stat to be looking at right? Isn't BetFlop% a better stat to be looking at when assesing donkbets?

It seems obvious to me, but i've seen lots of people drawing inferences from Agg. Factor. Am I missing something there by taking the aggression factor stat too literally (ie. How often somebody raises&bets versus how often they just call)?

I think thats n00bish enough to go in this thread.

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i dont use this stat to infer much about thier donk bets. generally donk bets from TAGs mean they hit a set and are tryying to pressure u into raising (very +EV play in multiway pots when u have ppl to act after u). and LAGs just do it

most ppl over-use the AF #. that number doesnt have much meaning because it doesnt mean anything until u get to a big sample size (400+hands)

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Agression Factor doesn't take folding into account. So if I folded every hand that I missed the flop and never called but always bet or raised when I hit the flop my agression factor would be infinity. I've seen people infer that the higher the agression factor the higher % chance that the person is bluffing, that's not true.

People seem to refuse to learn this and even when I have linked them to the information, they have written out responses like I didn't check the link but you are wrong, lol.

Agression factor used in unison with Fold TO CB% and CB% is a useful stat.

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Link please?

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Don't bother with the link - he's wrong


[img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[Landlord79]

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How many stats do you display on your HUD? I'm still using the default opponent stats for PAHUD, and I'm thinking of adding some additional ones. At first, it was confusing and distracting, but I've gotten used to the HUD.

Also, how high does the SB and BB's "Fold To Steal %" need to be before you're willing to steal with ATC from button or SB?

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I have the Holy Trinity (VPIP/PFR%/AF) plus Folds to Cbet, Cbet%, WTSD% and # of hands- diplayed on my HUD.

I steal w/ ATC into players w/ VPIP of <20 and F2CB of >60%.
Calling my pfr then folding to my CBet is much more +EV than simply folding pf.

[Mike Kelley]

It's at the top of ths SSNL sticky

Mason55 wrote it. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[Albert Moulton]

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Is it ever right to fold the smallest pocket pairs when you are first into the pot in EP? This is mostly for tight online games, NL$100+.

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With deep stacks (~200bb) and reasonably good players it is often good to fold 22-55 in early position because when you hit, you don't usually get paid off enough unless somebody behind you has a higher set. Bob Ciaffone wrote in PL&NLP, "I recommend playing dueces through fives only in late position and unraised pots."

In most games, however, a set is a set and overpairs will stack off often enough to play low pairs from almost any position as long as you are not calling off more than 10% of your stack preflop for the chance to see the flop.

The 5-10 rule works. Call a raise with a small to mid pair if it is less than 5% of effective stacks. Fold if it is more than 10%. Make a judgement call to fold or call in between.

[Bubbagump]

Kind of a broad noob question but....

Since I started playing micro NL a little over a month ago, I find that a lot off my losses so far are occuring on the river. At the 5NL & 10NL limits, is it safe to assume that TPTK is never going to be good when faced with a pot sized or greater all-in bet or raise on the river when the villain in an unknown and has called bets on every street?

Does the answer change if I checked the turn for pot control?

[Landlord79]

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lol, weren't you the one that told me I was wrong but I'm not looking? It's in the SSNL sticky maybe, I can't remember for sure and I'm not going digging for it again, sorry.

AF = Bet + Raise / call <-------- No fold accounted for.

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You're a very funny man... haha

[peterpjames]

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Kind of a broad noob question but....

Since I started playing micro NL a little over a month ago, I find that a lot off my losses so far are occuring on the river. At the 5NL & 10NL limits, is it safe to assume that TPTK is never going to be good when faced with a pot sized or greater all-in bet or raise on the river when the villain in an unknown and has called bets on every street?

Does the answer change if I checked the turn for pot control?

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At these levels when people put in a big raise, one pair hands (and most of the time two pair hands) are just no good.

One of the biggest things in boosting my winrate the past few months has been playing TPTK and vulnerable overpair hands a lot more cautiously. Well, maybe cautious isn't the word for it, because you want to remain aggressive, but you need to be careful to. Think about it this way, if you are showing aggression on every street and a guy still comes back over the top of you, at this level they aren't bluffing. Fold your JJ on a 97732 board and move on to the next hand.

The key to playing in position is that it allows you to control the pot, and make it big or keep it small. Keep pots small that you don't want to spiral out of control. Good players may lose a lot of small pots, but they lose very few medium sized pots because they won't pay off people as often because they are controlling the hands, and this makes it easy for them to tell when others have something good.

[Landlord79]

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Kind of a broad noob question but....

Since I started playing micro NL a little over a month ago, I find that a lot off my losses so far are occuring on the river. At the 5NL & 10NL limits, is it safe to assume that TPTK is never going to be good when faced with a pot sized or greater all-in bet or raise on the river when the villain in an unknown and has called bets on every street?

Does the answer change if I checked the turn for pot control?

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"Bets on the turn and river are rarely bluffs" - paraphrased Phil Helmuth

You definitely have to call more often on the river when you Induce a Bluff. That's part of why you check the turn, to induce a bluff on the river. The river bet should be around the range of a typical turn bet and you save yourself a big river bet if you are beat.

commence flaming for the Helmuth quote

[Landlord79]

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also, specific reads I'm trying to pick up on everyone I play:

-how they play sets
-how they play overpairs
-how they play big draws
-checkraising range (usually monsters)
-whether they fold weak donkbets to raises
-capability to bluff river

am I missing anything?

thx!

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Make sure your list doesn't limit you to what you are looking for. I general look for errors in my opponent's game first, then make notes on what they did in big/key hands. I don't have to be in the hand w/ them, I just want to see what they do with big hands and I try to find out what they are doing w/ big and small bets.

[Mike Kelley]

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lol, weren't you the one that told me I was wrong but I'm not looking? It's in the SSNL sticky maybe, I can't remember for sure and I'm not going digging for it again, sorry.

AF = Bet + Raise / call <-------- No fold accounted for.

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You're a very funny man... haha

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QFT