Instead of live $1/5... ?

[cmurl904]

It seems the majority on this forum feel that live $1/5 is
hurting the future of stud, and helping the casinos (with the rake). If it was up to you, considering where you play, etc...What would you spread instead of $1/5 ?
I know some places have spread games like 2/5, 2/6, & 2/10.
Some of these games have antes, some don't.

I'd like to see $3/6 with a .50 ante-$1 bring in, & a bigger game of $6/12 with a $1 ante-$2 bring in.
The 3/6 would definitely play more like a "real" game than the 1/5 spread. The 6/12 would encourage more action than a 5/10 with .50 ante-$2 bring in (Although I like 5/10 in AC).
Any thoughts ?

[Bremen]

I was thinking about how to include stud in low limit rotation games. Given that there's always issues with who's paid blinds etc. I thought it might be worth it to use the button in stud games and have the blinds post antes for the entire table. This will eliminate the need for quarters/half dollars. Problems with who's paid blinds during which games would disappear. Also this would encourage more action as you'll have larger antes than you normally do now.

[Andy B]

Canterbury Park offers stud games with these structures:

$2/4--$.50 ante, $1 force
$3/6--$.50 ante, $1 force
$4/8--$.50 ante, $2 force
$6/12--$1 ante, $2 force

In practice, the $2/4 game is the only one that goes during the week, with $6/12 and occasionally $4/8 usually going on weekends. Lately, it's usually been a $6/12 stud/8 game, but it's an either/or situation between that and $4/8 Omaha/8.

Canterbury opened its room in 2000. At that time, about 1/3 of the games were stud. They've promoted hold'em rather aggressively and haven't done much of anything to promote stud. Offering games with better structures is not going to suddenly make people want to play stud.

Sometimes a button is used determine who posts the antes in stud tournaments. For example, the usual ante in $15/30 stud is $2. Because there are usually only $5, $25, and $100 chips in play early on, the button will ante $15 for the table. So the ante is actually about the same.

[Cooling Heels]

[ QUOTE ]
I was thinking about how to include stud in low limit rotation games.

[/ QUOTE ]

The 3/6 mixed game at Caesars Palace played the stud/8 game as no ante. You would expect that structure to create a "too tight" game, but most of the players were off duty dealers so that wasn't the case.

The Palace Station dealt 3/6 stud/8 with a .25 ante, which is reasonable, but most rooms don't keep quarters in the tray so there's another excuse for keeping stud out of the rotation. I'd recommend using two $1 blinds during the stud portion of a 3/6 mixed game.

[Cooling Heels]

[ QUOTE ]
Canterbury Park offers stud games with these structures:

$2/4--$.50 ante, $1 force
$3/6--$.50 ante, $1 force
$4/8--$.50 ante, $2 force
$6/12--$1 ante, $2 force


Offering games with better structures is not going to suddenly make people want to play stud.



[/ QUOTE ]

The 2/4 and 4/8 structures are just plain lousy, but you are right Andy, fixing the structures won't encourage players to try stud. The overwhelming majority of players walk in the door to play Hold Em with no intention of trying other games.

[UpstateNYAAonly]

Stud is definately dying out in casinos from what i have heard, i learned how to play NL Texas Holdem about 2 1/2 years ago but stud has become my game of choice, i play weekly at turning stone casino in upstate ny and the only stud game they offer is 1-5 spread limit, i always tell them to get a 2-10 or even a 5/10 with ante game going but the old timers like to bet 1 on every street so they never open one up......the game is extremely beatable

[cmurl904]

[ QUOTE ]
the old timers like to bet 1 on every street so they never open one up......the game is extremely beatable

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree, $1/5 IS beatable. I've played a lot of $1/5 in AC at the Trop & Taj. The 1/5 stud games on Fri./Sat. nights from 10PM-4AM are very loose. If you stay sober and play ABC stud, you'll profit. These games usually have a lot of blue-collar guys in their late 30's-50's drinking heavily/having a few laughs. They only know "kitchen table/rec. room" stud, or what their uncle Joe taught them 25 years ago. They've never read a poker book or been on this forum. Unfortunately for us stud players, a lot of these guys have switched over to $2/4, 3/6 & 4/8 hold 'em.

On the other hand, if you play $1/5 during the week, you'll get into the "rock garden" games. These games will have players with an average age of 70+, with the majority of them being somewhat grumpy. Most of these guys only know how to play stud, and don't like/want to play hold 'em.
These guys have played a lot of stud in the VFW/American Legion/Elks lodges, where they've learned a lot of bad habits. Just because you've been playing poker for 40+ years, doesn't mean you know what you're really doing. They usually never bluff or raise, and they get grouchy when you do. So, they end up folding....a lot. These guys also love to chase straights, so hold on to your high two pairs, they'll usually win against these kind of guys.

I like the $5/10 (.50 ante, $2 bring in) stud at the Trop in AC. It's usually good, without a lot of rocky old timers.
It goes every day with anywhere from 1-3 tables depending on the list. The Taj has more games, but 5/10 is tight with more knowledgeable stud players than the Trop.
It is a little better on Fri/Sat. nights though.

[UpstateNYAAonly]

wow i would love to have a 5/10 game at turning stone casino, i know i am a better rounded NL player but i have never left the 1/5 game without a profit, as we all know with no limit it is possible to leave in the hole, the old timers at the 1/5 game here are pretty rocky but as u said love to chase straights and flushs, and they almost NEVER raise, i found that kind of strange, well if anyone is near turning stone casino Wednesday morning ill be at the stud game before the noon tournament, going for 3rd final table in a row

[cmurl904]

If you like stud you should play in AC sometime.
I don't live in the area anymore, so I only get to play there 4-5 times a year.
I usually play 5/10 at the Trop or Taj. If Borgata had consistent 5/10 or a 10/20 I'd play there instead.

$1/5-Taj, Trop, Harrah's, Bally's, Hilton, sometimes Borgata, Sands-had a .25 cent ante room is closing though
3/6- Taj, newer game-no ante
5/10- Taj, Trop, sometimes Borgata
10/20-Taj, sometimes Borgata
10/20/30-Trop-only on weekends
15/30/45-Borgata-goes pretty regular
20/40-Taj
Borgata has a 75/150 game that goes regularly, some of the guys on this forum play in that game.

Stud's not completely dead in AC for now...