Frustration...

[Master_Shake]

After my first 135 Sit-n-goes i have an ROI of -1.21%... I usually make it to the final 6 players just playing tight and(from what i understand so far) standard low level blind play. But when the blinds get to 75-150 and above i pretty much have no idea what to do... i'll often have a stack of 10bb or less with the blinds going up next hand... and push something like a K9 without any idea if its correct or not... a lot of the situations i think to myself "what would the guys at 2+2 say to do" I'll try and take a step back from the situation and take in all the info that i can (stack sizes... blinds... starting hand... how villain(s) is playing...number of players left etc...) and still be completely stuck...

i really want to join SNG icons (looks like the best videos for STT and i would want to support guys that post on here...) but my bankroll is 100 (79$ now...) and i play 3.40s so i dont think its practical to pay upwards of 150 dollars even though i want to learn... i have the new Sit-n-go Book from 2+2 and have read it once... the only thing that i really took away from it was how to play low blinds, EV and tournament equity...

i have been lurking these forms for a little while and just recently started to post hands and questions... but what is the best way without spending hundreds of dollars on software or videos to learn mid-high blind play and what to do on the bubble. i guess I'm just sort of venting right now and mad, mainly at my self for not being able to figure it out on my own...

[billybeartku]

read Dan Harrington on Holdem 1,2,3 to get a better sense of tournament poker. SNG strategy isn't very appropriate for beginners IMO. Welcome to the forum, post some hands here and you'll get tons insights from other good players. I'm also learning how to play sng too.

[Daddys_Visa]

[ QUOTE ]
After my first 135 Sit-n-goes i have an ROI of -1.21%... I usually make it to the final 6 players just playing tight and(from what i understand so far) standard low level blind play. But when the blinds get to 75-150 and above i pretty much have no idea what to do... i'll often have a stack of 10bb or less with the blinds going up next hand... and push something like a K9 without any idea if its correct or not... a lot of the situations i think to myself "what would the guys at 2+2 say to do" I'll try and take a step back from the situation and take in all the info that i can (stack sizes... blinds... starting hand... how villain(s) is playing...number of players left etc...) and still be completely stuck...

i really want to join SNG icons (looks like the best videos for STT and i would want to support guys that post on here...) but my bankroll is 100 (79$ now...) and i play 3.40s so i dont think its practical to pay upwards of 150 dollars even though i want to learn... i have the new Sit-n-go Book from 2+2 and have read it once... the only thing that i really took away from it was how to play low blinds, EV and tournament equity...

i have been lurking these forms for a little while and just recently started to post hands and questions... but what is the best way without spending hundreds of dollars on software or videos to learn mid-high blind play and what to do on the bubble. i guess I'm just sort of venting right now and mad, mainly at my self for not being able to figure it out on my own...

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, the first step is admitting you have a problem so you are already on your way to recovery.

The only thing I can tell you is that SnGs are a game of pattern recognition. After a while, you will know ICM in your sleep. ICM will make you at least a breakeven player. You just have to play hundreds of SnGs for the patterns of when to push and when to fold to become imprinted for you. I would recommend to keep reading posts here and post hands you are struggling with. After a while, the overall gist of high blind play will become apparent to you.

[dw33b]

I don't know how much help to you I could be, but as a fellow 3.4 player, I wouldn't mind having someone at the same level to go over HH's with, etc. PM me if you're interested.

[gwp]

[ QUOTE ]
...i'll often have a stack of 10bb or less with the blinds going up next hand... and push something like a K9 without any idea if its correct or not...

[/ QUOTE ]

http://sngwiz.com/ has a free 30 day trial

[ymu]

So many of the posts on this forum deal with exactly your problem. Read and absorb, post hands you're not sure about.

Get a free trial of sngwiz, but it's not difficult to do the calcs with a spreadsheet and pokerstove. It might be tedious at times, but with practice you'll be able to approximate the calcs at the table fairly easily.

STTs are weird, and require you to make a lot of counterintuitive plays. If you do the maths, you'll understand why - which makes it a lot easier to push 83o or fold QQ or whatever. Knowing the theory is fine, but you also have to put it into practice. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[BicVicTheQuick]

Here a few tipps for you:

- restock your bankroll a little bit and start playing the 6+0.50 SNG's! It's hard to beat the rake at the 3+.40 as it is definetively toooo high!

- read everything you can find about ICM BEFORE you get the trial version of SNGWIZ. You'll find plenty of input at these frum or just google it. There are also free ICM calculators online where you can get a feeling for it. When you have SNGWIZ (or similar software) " PLAY WITh IT". I learned more from changing ranges, changing chip stacks, adding or removing players etc. then from anything else! This helps dramatically to get an idea of the STT-end game and helps to adjust your play to the different levels/situations.

- post hands here and read hands posted here. Try to find an answer by yourself BEFORE you read the respones of the others. Best would be to take a piece of paper and a pencil and write your answer down, then compare with the other posters.

- read Harrington oH 1+2 (Part 3 is nice but not a must).

- read any piece of STT-strategy you can find somewhere! (I've even read a lot of bad once and learned a lot from them, mainly "how not to play SNG")

- patience: it takes some time until you "REALLY" understand how to play SNG's...(You will never understand it completely as there will always be something you can learn but at least get a good idea of it)

Good luck

[Jbrochu]

If you really can't afford one of the ICM programs, download a free ICM calculator and learn how to do them manually using the ICM calc and a spreadsheet.

Regarding HoH1 - Good basic advice but tighten up the starting hands in the early rounds.

Regarding HoH2 - you can use M but SnG convention is BB and it's easier to calculate. More importantly, Harrington's advice for pushing (especially with ~ 10BB or more and from EP) is generally too aggressive. (Most of his advice pertains to MTTs where you ideally want to finish in the top few % to maximize expectation.)

Regarding Moshman: I think his book will be a good primer for you but be wary of his postflop advice. I think he raises too much for "information" and advocates blocking bets too often. I learned a lot more about early blind postflop play from Wiggs, Pudge, Devinlake, and Unarmed among others.

Read Chris Fergusons section on postflop play in the Full Tilt book. This section explains better than anything I've read when and why to bet, raise, or check.

Read this forum for advice on high blind push/fold play and dominating the bubble.

Someone mentioned trial versions of the ICM programs. I forget what's in the trial version but if it's free give it a shot. Also, Bubble Trainer used to give you 50 free hands a month. Do that if it's still available. The immediate feedback is great.

Also, most players start out as losers and it seems you're playing close to breakeven. Your sample size is too small really to draw any conclusions but you're at least not losing much money yet as you learn. My first deposit was for $800 and I dropped all the way to $300 playing $5's before I turned it around and started winning.

[Jbrochu]

I wanted to add something to my response but it was too late to edit.

I might get flamed a bit for this but here goes: I believe as you're learning to play, when you find yourself unsure of the correct move when forced to a call/fold decision on the end - as a beginner you should often call. This assumes you will then review these hands while considering what you knew about villain in order to make a more informed future decision. If you're always folding in these spots it's going to be more difficult to learn IMO.

Of course, when I first started playing Irieguy was posting a lot and his posts convinced me it was fine to go broke as long as I could reload without too much pain. Adjust accordingly based on your financial situation.

[mattiesmat]

I am/have been in your also and I might be able to give you some advice.
I am a winning player at the 3.4's and I am currently moving up to the $6.5's.
When I start playing I first start an empty word document (and some music), then I start PokerTracker and PokerAce-HUD and then finally I start my tables.
When I play and I am unsure of what the correct play is/was I save the hand history in the document.
When it is a ICM/bubble decision, I also take a print screen (with alt+print screen) of the table and I also paste it in the document below the hand history, this way I have my opponents stats and I can set their ranges (later) accurate.

After playing I go through all my saved problem hands myself and give them a quick review.
The hands that I am still unsure about I post on the forum or at least let a good player review it.
Then I insert all saved ICM trouble hands in SNG-wizard and I check whether to push/call/fold, using my screenshots to set ranges.

After all this I am ready to play more games and repeat this process and of course I keep checking my posted hands on the forum.

This is quite a lot of work, but it is well worth it if you want to improve, it has helped me a lot.
I 4-6 table and a set takes about ~50 minutes and all the work after takes about 15.

Hope this helps!