50NL AKs hows my line?

[QuadLaser]

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I agree with matrix. You guys have to realize that a 83/28/1.2 and a 50/14/2.7 are both VERY aggressive post-flop. The chances that both check behind are pretty slim. Actually if both do check behind it's probably more likely that we are beat already than if one of them bets.

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83/28 players are monkeys. He can't lay a hand down preflop as "tempting" as T2o or 95. He's not laying down any piece of this board. He gets a special thrill from calling your PSB with a gut-shot and getting there. Lets give him that chance, bet for value on the flop, and protection from free draws "just in case" they check it through.

[thoman8r]

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I agree with matrix. You guys have to realize that a 83/28/1.2 and a 50/14/2.7 are both VERY aggressive post-flop. The chances that both check behind are pretty slim. Actually if both do check behind it's probably more likely that we are beat already than if one of them bets.

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83/28 players are monkeys. He can't lay a hand down preflop as "tempting" as T2o or 95. He's not laying down any piece of this board. He gets a special thrill from calling your PSB with a gut-shot and getting there. Lets give him that chance, bet for value on the flop, and protection from free draws "just in case" they check it through.

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83/28 indicates he's a huge donk but it doesn't mean he'll call AI with air. It does mean that he's likely to bet AI with air or a marginal holding.

Also to a previous poster - a 1.2 AF is very aggro for an 83% VPIP. And a 2.7 is super aggro for a 50% VPIP. Please remember what AF means - this guy is playing more than 4 out of 5 hands and is *still* betting or raising more than he is calling, even though he is whiffing completely 2/3 of the time. Think about that for a second.

Honestly I think this is a perfect flop to CRAI.

[thursday]

i also disagree with a check raise here. a lead-shove is powerful and will get them to fold their worse hands, but i'd really be satisfied with just taking this down here. there are a lot of bad cards that can come on a board like this and i would not want to put them in a position where they're potstuck.

[matrix]

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a lead-shove is powerful and will get them to fold their worse hands,

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why on earth do you want them to fold WORSE hands?????

sense none making is.

as played hte OP hand is fine - but I think we gets more monies the times one of these LAG morans decides to try and rep AK with his 74o and sees our checking as weak.

i) we are pushing any turn card so we are giving these donks a one time one shot chance to spike their draw IF they even have a draw and IF they don't bet this flop then they will get to draw - otherwise all our chips are in the middle.

ii) lets say doomsday scenario happens and they both check behind - there are about 12 cards we don't like much - so about 75% of the time those cards aren't coming.

iii) if the turn bricks then they are calling our turn push with the same crappy gs draw that they would have called our flop push - only now they can only see ONE more card not two so our Equity increases.

I think the small risk of letting them hit the turn is more than outweighed by the increased monies we make when one of these aggro lagtards decides to try and bluff us off of TPTK - if we open push the flop then that can never happen.

as played OP hand is +EV - I am saying that I think a c/r all-in on this flop is ++EV.

[That Fish]

I like the flop push. These guys are never folding a draw here, and there are a whole bunch of Jx hands as well as Qx hands that are pair + gutshot. 78 hit an OESD, what exactly are we folding out here? Just about everything in their range caught a piece.

Not to mention a flop push here is something THEY would do with a gutshot. These guys don't think about how a TAG would play a given hand, they only know how they would do it and act accordingly.

UTG is short and will call off his last $14 with anything he decided to raise preflop, and CO can't fold once he sees UTG call because, well, someone else called so it must be a good idea.

If they do miraculously find a fold here the pot is big enough that I wouldn't mind taking it down anyway.

Anything else feels like FPS with 2 lags like this in the hand and hero being OOP.

[thursday]

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a lead-shove is powerful and will get them to fold their worse hands,

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why on earth do you want them to fold WORSE hands?????


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because their hands aren't tragically behind in this spot, and after any bet they make they're going to be committed to call. whereas if you just shove here you can just take down the huge pot as is, or allow them to make an even more gross call with a worse hand.

[thoman8r]

What? You are kidding right? A LOT of their worse hands are WAY behind and will fold if we shove. We don't want to fold out a gutshot, a PP, or air. You are just being a nit if you are afraid of one of those hands.

[thursday]

nm read flop wrong. a shove still isn't bad.

[Nick Royale]

I just shove. Check/raising is probably ok though.