JJ vs. thac, turn question - Page 2

AZplaya · #11 10-30-2007, 01:55 AM

so obv the best line is to somehow provoke thac to say skull[censored] in chat, then email ftp and get him banned from teh poker so he's not knitting sweaters at every one of my [censored] tables [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]. Also mods if were in the banning mood, why not ban this MJ of Poker who almost got the FTP regs thread locked for trolling and is now clearly trolling in this thread.

pineapple888 · #12 10-30-2007, 01:57 AM

[ QUOTE ]
why not ban this MJ of Poker who almost got the FTP regs thread locked for trolling and is now clearly trolling in this thread.

[/ QUOTE ]

C'mon dude. MJ's just on E, why bring out the banstick?

hotbacon · #13 10-30-2007, 02:09 AM

check fold

DaycareInferno · #14 10-30-2007, 02:58 AM

i don't understand why c/f is so popular. is it because:

a)we're worried about this turn card and/or flop call from a 17/14? because i'm definately not.

b)he will rarely bet, and usually when he does bet its with hands that beat us or air, and air isn't a big part of his range?

i bet here with JJ, despite of lack of value, because its usually the best hand, and i don't really like people thinking they can show down 66 type hands for one bet against me a high percentage of the time. its kind of intersting how much different the ss responses were from the micro responese. c/f was the least popular there, and the most here.

djj6835 · #15 10-30-2007, 03:04 AM

[ QUOTE ]
b)he will rarely bet, and usually when he does bet its with hands that beat us or air, and air isn't a big part of his range?

[/ QUOTE ]

This is basically why I would c/f. I also mentioned in the micro thread that if villain is good he is betting nearly every river with air since we basically can't get to the river like this with a strong hand. If anything c/c is better than b/f here bc you are basically just betting to avoid being bluffed, but I still don't like that bc I don't expect to get to show my hand down against a decent player.

DaycareInferno · #16 10-30-2007, 03:06 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
b)he will rarely bet, and usually when he does bet its with hands that beat us or air, and air isn't a big part of his range?

[/ QUOTE ]

This is basically why I would c/f. I also mentioned in the micro thread that if villain is good he is betting nearly every river with air since we basically can't get to the river like this with a strong hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

ok, i can buy that. i don't think we'd face a turn bet after checking nearly as often as a lot of the regs in micro imply.

ikestoys · #17 10-30-2007, 03:07 AM

c/c is only good if you are assuming that thac will turn a made hand like 66 into a bluff on the turn and doesn't play a flush or Q the same way. Am I extremely worried about the flush? No not really, but it should freeze him just as much as me.

[ QUOTE ]

i bet here with JJ, despite of lack of value, because its usually the best hand

[/ QUOTE ]
this is not good reasoning, its either c/c or c/f, unless you think he is calling with worse.
[ QUOTE ]
its kind of intersting how much different the ss responses were from the micro responese. c/f was the least popular there, and the most here.

[/ QUOTE ]
it is, it's showing that SSNL is much better that micro at a pretty basic level (and I mean that in the nicest way)

DaycareInferno · #18 10-30-2007, 03:13 AM

[ QUOTE ]
c/c is only good if you are assuming that thac will turn a made hand like 66 into a bluff on the turn and doesn't play a flush or Q the same way. Am I extremely worried about the flush? No not really, but it should freeze him just as much as me.

[ QUOTE ]

i bet here with JJ, despite of lack of value, because its usually the best hand

[/ QUOTE ]
this is not good reasoning, its either c/c or c/f, unless you think he is calling with worse.
[ QUOTE ]
its kind of intersting how much different the ss responses were from the micro responese. c/f was the least popular there, and the most here.

[/ QUOTE ]
it is, it's showing that SSNL is much better that micro at a pretty basic level (and I mean that in the nicest way)

[/ QUOTE ]

i dunno, to be perfectly fair, there are a lot more villain's at micro tables that ARE going to bet the turn there with hands they shouldn't.

as far as my personal reasons for betting, i don't really see how the logic is flawed, even if it isn't best. wouldn't you agree that there is some degree of tradeoff between present and future hands as far as profitability goes?

ikestoys · #19 10-30-2007, 03:17 AM

[ QUOTE ]
i dunno, to be perfectly fair, there are a lot more villain's at micro tables that ARE going to bet the turn there with hands they shouldn't.

[/ QUOTE ]
If you had the read that the villain was a complete donk, then fine. But thats not our read here.

[ QUOTE ]
as far as my personal reasons for betting, i don't really see how the logic is flawed, even if it isn't best. wouldn't you agree that there is some degree of tradeoff between present and future hands as far as profitability goes?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure exactly what you are trying to say. But betting because we are ahead of the villains range atm is not a reason to bet, we have to be ahead of the villain's calling range. The options here are c/c or c/f. This isn't a proper spot to b/f because no worse hands call you. If you want to c/c because of a read you have, then ok, but we don't have that read here.

DaycareInferno · #20 10-30-2007, 03:21 AM

ike, what i mean is that villain rarely has a better hand, or a worse hand that bets into us anyway, so i'm perfectly fine with just folding him out and regretting calling the flop bet. that way when i have a busted KJ or something in a spot that i can't double barrel, he's more likely to fold to the first bet.