99 in BB vs. PFR and a board that gets scarier and scarier...

[BadBigBabar]

boz i think you are being a bit results and river oriented, no? in the heat of the moment after c/r flop i think we both lead most any turn really.

[bravos1]

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(fwiw, your check-fold on the river is pretty bad.)

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why?

The turn may be closer to a c/f, but the river if def a check/fold.

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What are you trying to accomplish with a bet on the turn if you're going to check-fold the river against an aggro opponent? Get value from a hand that has 10 outs to beat you (AK)?

Edit: fwiw, I agree with Babar when he says that this is mostly just a gross spot that happens sometimes and it sucks. The only question is when we get away from it. I prefer to get away from it earlier.

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yes.. and that is why I said the turn is closer to a c/f. But as played, this is not one of those situations that if we bet/call a bet on the turn that we have to see a SD or b/f. This river is a horrible card and as played a c/f is best.

[maverickai]

I would play the way you did. With that many painted cards on the board, he would have hit anyone, and be in call down mode. Too many hands could have beaten you. What could he be holding that you can beat, given the line he took? AT+, any broadways could have gotten you beaten.

[bellatrix]

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I *like* the checkraise but then I've isolated myself OOP with second pair and only 2 outs if I'm trailing. I start to hate putting in money on the flop.

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But IMO we aren't trailing behind often, which is why c/r makes sense. That flop looks pretty safe.
Personally, unless I had a read, I would've 3-bet here pre-flop. But that's just my playing style. I like to put people to decisions rather than them putting me to decisions, so that they can make more mistakes.

Anyway, I don't think the c/f on the river is as bad as boz thinks.

[Aaron W.]

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Anyway, I don't think the c/f on the river is as bad as boz thinks.

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K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] is a terrible card for you, which makes the check-fold on the end better. If you check-folded an offsuit brick, that would be pretty bad.

[favreftw]

I like the way you played this hand..can't really see myself playing it any other way.

i think 3 betting preflop is a good option though as others in the thread have said

[Fadook]

:grunch:

I like it. That river puts you behind way too much.

[Fluffy_Shark]

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K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] is a terrible card for you, which makes the check-fold on the end better. If you check-folded an offsuit brick, that would be pretty bad.

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Also, I always 3bet 99 preflop in this spot.

[bozlax]

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boz i think you are being a bit results and river oriented, no? in the heat of the moment after c/r flop i think we both lead most any turn really.

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My bigger problem is that if you lead the turn I hate a c/f on the river. Let's look at a distribution, I may be way off.

His range is 77+/AT+/KQ/KJ, yea? And doesn't change much during the hand, really.

hand pfcombos flopcombos turncombos rivcombos
AA: 6 6 6 6
KK: 6 6 6 3
QQ: 6 6 3 3
JJ: 6 3 3 3
TT; 6 6 6 6
99: 1 1 1 1
88: 6 6 6 6
77: 6 6 6 6
AK: 16 16 16 12
AQ: 16 16 12 12
AJ: 16 12 12 12
AT: 16 16 16 16
KQ: 16 16 12 9
KJ: 16 12 12 9

On the turn, we're behind 72 combos, ahead of 44 and tied with 1. On the river you're behind 91, ahead of 12 and tied with 1.

Looks like I was wr....wr...well, you know.[/fonzie] Here's a question, tho: does AT stick around on the turn, if it's not double-diamond? Because if it doesn't, that makes the turn behind 72, ahead of 29 and tied with 1, and makes it much closer to a c/f. (Not really, but firing again doesn't look so great, either. I dunno, 88/77 maybe go away to the flop c/r, too...99?...TT?.)