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  #61  
Old 11-28-2007, 05:23 PM
gumpzilla gumpzilla is offline
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Default Re: Man kills 2 People While 911 Is Telling Him Not To

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He could just have stayed in his house and he would've avoided this situation, therefor his action was completely unnecessary .

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Would it then not be murder if the old man went outside unarmed and the thugs shanked him and killed him?

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Why are you trolling this thread so hard?
  #62  
Old 11-28-2007, 05:24 PM
ohead ohead is offline
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Default Re: Man kills 2 People While 911 Is Telling Him Not To

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He could just have stayed in his house and he would've avoided this situation, therefor his action was completely unnecessary .

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Would it then not be murder if the old man went outside unarmed and the thugs shanked him and killed him?

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Of course it would be murder, what does this have to do with anything? He put himself in eventual dangers way.

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ohead - How do you know the man wasn't threatened in some manner by the criminals? You seem kind of prejudiced.

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uhm he went out there with the intention to kill the burglars, thats what I call premeditated murder.
People planning to commit murder generally don't call the police first. Maybe he was leveling 911.

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He could just have stayed in his house and he would've avoided this situation, therefor his action was completely unnecessary [ QUOTE ]

LOL crimeaments. For you, what is the threshold for stopping the criminals? What do they have to be doing in order for you to confront them? Put yourself in this guy's shoes where you have a gun and the police aren't going to get there in time.

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This guy apparently didn't have all his marbles since he says clearly that he's gonna kill them first to the 911 guy.

And the threshold is if there is people in the house who are in danger.
  #63  
Old 11-28-2007, 05:38 PM
Boris Boris is offline
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Default Re: Man kills 2 People While 911 Is Telling Him Not To

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uhm he went out there with the intention to kill the burglars, thats what I call premeditated murder.

He could just have stayed in his house and he would've avoided this situation, therefor his action was completely unnecessary .

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You're making two contradictory points here. On the one hand you think the guy is guilty of first degree murder. Which honestly doesn't make any sense because why call the friggin cops in the first place. And then you go on to make the odd statement that he could have avoided the situation by staying inside. Why didn't you say could have avoided the situation by not pulling the trigger? Or he could have avoided the situation by not being a cold blooded murderer? Or he could have avoided the situation by not going outside with a shotgun? No, you made that statement because deep down you know that guy probably fired the gun in self defense. But in your opinion, he should have never tried to stop the guys in the first place.
  #64  
Old 11-28-2007, 05:42 PM
Boris Boris is offline
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Default Re: Man kills 2 People While 911 Is Telling Him Not To

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Why are you trolling this thread so hard?

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WTF are you talking about? There were several clowns who said the guy never should have put himself in the dangerous situation. This implies that if the old man was the one who ended up getting hurt, it would have been the old man's fault.
  #65  
Old 11-28-2007, 05:44 PM
PITTM PITTM is offline
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Default Re: Man kills 2 People While 911 Is Telling Him Not To

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Diablo - If the guy shot for the sole purpose of not letting the criminals get away then I would not consider him a hero.

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Wait, so what was heroic? The fact that he shot them once he said they came onto his property?
  #66  
Old 11-28-2007, 05:45 PM
PartyGirlUK PartyGirlUK is offline
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Default Re: Man kills 2 People While 911 Is Telling Him Not To

Boris, which parts of 'Wanna make a bet? I'm gonna kill 'em' and 'Bang you're dead' makes you think he wasn't intending to kill these guys?

What part of his constant 'I can't get them get away with this', 'They have a bag of loot.....this is ridiculous' etc makes you believe he wasn't trying to confront them for vigilante reasons?

Believing that he has the right to take out burglars is a legit point of view. I don't agree with it, but it's legit. But listening to that phone call and coming away with the belief that he went outside solely because his property was under serious threat, took every possible precaution to avoid injuring these guys, and fired only because he was threatened and there was no other to protect himself, is extraordinary.
  #67  
Old 11-28-2007, 05:48 PM
gumpzilla gumpzilla is offline
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Default Re: Man kills 2 People While 911 Is Telling Him Not To

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Why are you trolling this thread so hard?

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WTF are you talking about? There were several clowns who said the guy never should have put himself in the dangerous situation. This implies that if the old man was the one who ended up getting hurt, it would have been the old man's fault.

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It implies no such thing. Obviously the guys who kill him in that spot are morally responsible; equally obviously, putting oneself in that situation unnecessarily is retarded, risky, and likely to lead to outcomes such as this. For that reason the old man should not have done it.

As I said earlier in the thread, if I come to your house with a gun to kill you, and you pull a gun on me, I do not get to claim that I only responded in self-defense when I shot you. I think it is very plain from the 911 call that the guy was looking to administer justice, and the bits about protecting himself are ad hoc rationalizations after the fact. "They were in my lawn, I didn't know what was going to happen." Well, you'd already made it clear you were planning on going outside several minutes ago, and that the only thing holding you up was that you didn't know that neighbor that well ("if it was my other neighbor I would have acted already, I know him pretty well.") His self-defense justification is complete [censored].
  #68  
Old 11-28-2007, 06:01 PM
manbearpig manbearpig is offline
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Default Re: Man kills 2 People While 911 Is Telling Him Not To

Thread in Politics on this a week or two ago. But here are my .02 cents.

1) Old guy witnesses a robbery.
2) Calls cops.
3) Robbers leaving house before cops get there, presumably going to get away.
4) Old guy thinks he is within his rights to protect his neighbors property with force.
5) Goes outside, warns them, then shoots them.

Seems simple enough to me. The writer on the law says it was not to be interpreted to cover something like this but I think it is arguable at least.


Those of you in the "it was only a VCR camp:" Where do you draw the line? Any amount of property?

Or what if it was your own house? And the robber did not know you were there and you knew for a fact they were unarmed? Is force justified then?


The bottom line is that if somebody considering robbing a house thought there was a good chance they would get shot if caught they might think long and hard before stealing a couple hundred bucks worth of stuff.
  #69  
Old 11-28-2007, 06:02 PM
El Diablo El Diablo is offline
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Default Re: Man kills 2 People While 911 Is Telling Him Not To

Boris,

Did you listen to the whole 911 call?
  #70  
Old 11-28-2007, 06:12 PM
C-Dog C-Dog is offline
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Default Re: Man kills 2 People While 911 Is Telling Him Not To

I am not going to lose any sleep over the loss of these two scumbags. I hope the guy gets off, and I hope nobody else in his neighborhood gets robbed for the foreseeable future.
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