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#1
10-23-2007, 07:14 AM
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Re: Button steal hand leads to heated theory argument
"a guy calls your bet on a K-K-2 flop"
when most players do this against me i can correctly check the turn and fold the river when they bet. every once in awhile ill call if it's a player who can call light and then bluff or value bet a worse hand on the river. 
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#2
10-19-2007, 11:53 PM
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Re: Button steal hand leads to heated theory argument
I play it the way your roommate did, it's pretty much the default line, imo. To take a different line I think you've got to have a pretty good read on SB's play. There is another factor to consider in this case: SB called the flop bet with a player behind him with no way to know what that player would do. In a 3-way hand with the typical players the player who smooth calls in that situation has got the King. They have the King so often that I'd not mind if your roommate checked the turn but, still, I think b/f is the way to go.
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#4
10-20-2007, 12:03 AM
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Re: Button steal hand leads to heated theory argument
[ QUOTE ]
All-- Who else prefers 3-betting the turn to calling? --Nate [/ QUOTE ] Sounds like the Slippery Laggro Slope, which is only a good path to go down against TAGs.
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#5
10-20-2007, 11:43 AM
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Re: Button steal hand leads to heated theory argument
Does no one else feel like the SB has the ability to CR the turn with any of the following hands:
Diamond flush draw Spade Flush draw Pocket pairs 3-8 10-J A-10 A-J and in some instances... total air. I just feel like a tricky lose player (i.e. the small blind) is going to be willing to "make a move" on the turn to win the pot solely because it looks like my roomy is on a blatant button steal. Furthermore... I disagree with what private joker said about the 30-60 game at HG not having a lot of turn check raising. As a matter of fact... the 30-60 at HG seems to play a tad more aggressive than other mid-limit games I've played at the commerce.
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#7
10-20-2007, 11:44 AM
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Re: Button steal hand leads to heated theory argument
[ QUOTE ]
All-- Who else prefers 3-betting the turn to calling? --Nate [/ QUOTE ] Is this so that you can comfortably fold to a 4th bet and/or get a check/ check scenario on the river? I'm a little lost on this line?
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#8
10-22-2007, 02:26 PM
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Re: Button steal hand leads to heated theory argument
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] All-- Who else prefers 3-betting the turn to calling? --Nate [/ QUOTE ] Is this so that you can comfortably fold to a 4th bet and/or get a check/ check scenario on the river? I'm a little lost on this line? [/ QUOTE ] Yes, that would be the idea. Essentially a free showdown three bet. I don't like investing three bets with a pocket pair while two broadway overs are up there. But if you do then this is probably the best way to do it. He says to do this "instead of calling". I don't like calling here, but if you were going to then you have obviously made the decision that you will call unimproved on the river because you don't have the pot odds to call with a two outer. Some of your reason for calling would have to be that you feel your hand currently may be best. So, having mentally decided that you will put in another two bets after the check raise [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img] , I like Nate's idea. But that's the end of it. You fold to a 4 bet or to a river donk.
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#9
10-22-2007, 02:35 PM
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Re: Button steal hand leads to heated theory argument
What about calling, 3 betting, or checking to GET to showdown for another reason.
The pool of players that play that HG 30-60 are pretty small... I think it's important to let players know that you can't be check raised / bullied off hands. Right wrong or indifferent... the players in that game know that I'm the aggressor... I'm GETTING to showdown. For that reason I get more action with my big hands... and I feel like people don't try to "get" me to fold by making "plays"
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#10
10-20-2007, 12:34 PM
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Re: Button steal hand leads to heated theory argument
You're both right and it depends on the opponent.
99 is vulnerable and you don't want to give a free card if at all possible. On the other hand... If check/raising the turn is such a standard play with almost any hand as you say, then I'd bet the turn to induce a c/r. If check/raising a worst hand is just a decent possibility, then I'd check behind (as you advocated) and pay off the river. I'm certainly not gonna criticize your roommate's play. In many instances he would've played it perfectly. Or he might've done better to check, or call down. Depends on the player.
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