Paying for food/drinks/etc: Out of stack or wallet?

DonkeyKongSr · #1 11-13-2007, 06:14 PM

I'm an occassional live player and I've thought about this question quite a bit. It seems to be that almost everyone pays out of their stack, but I've got to think that's not the best approach for someone seeking to be a winning player because it actually costs you more money in the long run.

For example, if I were to pay $10 for food and tip to the server out of my stack, not only does it cost me $10, but it will cost me an additional $10 on a double up that may come along because I no longer have that $10 to double up. Essentially that food cost me $20 on my first double up, $40 on the next, and so forth. However, I guess the opposite is true that if I bust, the food essentially cost me nothing since I paid for it with money I would have lost anyway. Is my thinking correct on this?

In lower limit games, this can add up to quite a large percentage of winnings over time. If everyone at the table is paying for random stuff out of their stacks, you could be seeing $20-$30+/hour disappearing off the table in addition to rake and tips. Now I'm not going as far as saying you should tip out of your pocket because that would be a huge pain in the ass, but really that would make more sense for someone trying to make a living at poker.

Do you pay for things out of your stack or not? Do you have a reason you choose one or the other?

Currently I usually pay out of my stack, but I'm trying to be more vigilant about paying for anything I'm paying more than $5 for out of my wallet.

EDIT: This is all really assuming you are playing NL, particularly with a capped buyin.

BTMegaCash · #2 11-13-2007, 06:26 PM

pay with chips

TMTTR · #3 11-13-2007, 06:33 PM

Too much thinking. Use your chips.

DonkeyKongSr · #4 11-13-2007, 06:36 PM

Huh? Too much thinking about something can affect your winrate? WTF?

I have a $10 bill in my wallet and I have chips in front of me. Doesn't it make more sense to take a few seconds and pull the bill out of my wallet?

Magicmanu · #5 11-13-2007, 06:42 PM

I always pay from my pocket. It makes it easier to keep accurate track of wins and losses.

that_pope · #6 11-13-2007, 06:55 PM

I pay out of my stack, but I am a limit player who always have enough on the table to go plenty of bets (usually everyone covered if I am up more than a rack) unless I am on some long tilt driven journey that usually only happens once or twice a year.

But you bring up a point I thought of a few years ago when playing 1/2 NL at IP. They had a max buy-in of $100 at the time, and I had about doubled up when I got into a big pot with a player who had me covered. I had flopped top set w/ aces and led into the pot after raising preflop. As he was contemplating his action, the drink lady came by and being the alcoholic I am, I had to tip her $1 for my Corona she was bringing me. The guy pushed all in, I tipped her a dollar from my stack and called...if I had done it out of my pocket, $1 more for me, but that is pretty nitty now isn't it...

that_pope · #7 11-13-2007, 06:57 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I always pay from my pocket. It makes it easier to keep accurate track of wins and losses.

[/ QUOTE ]

Since I play semi professionally, and limit at that, I enjoy paying from my stack and having that roll into my wins or losses, because eating a meal at the table is something I wouldn't have done if I didn't go to the casino, I would have had a far cheaper meal at home. So I count that against my wins/losses just as you do with dealer tips/rake.

Seb86 · #8 11-13-2007, 07:03 PM

OP is 100% right, well it doenst make a HUGE difference but yeah once in a while it will cost you money to pay with chips on the table.

LateNiteRush · #9 11-13-2007, 07:05 PM

The place that I play at gives us free food, but I always tip out of my stack.

bav · #10 11-13-2007, 07:10 PM

If you are playing in a capped game and you have more than the cap in your stack, and you think having a big stack makes a big positive difference, then sure, pay outta yer pocket. If you're below the cap, and believe all of this, why aren't you topping up your stack after every hand?

Just read here in Cardplayer where Ed Miller spells out for the masses why having a short stack is not a disadvantage. It's been discussed a lot on 2+2, but the myth continues. This is the first good article I recall seeing on the topic in Cardplayer. http://www.cardplayer.com/magazine/article/17063