#11
|
|||
|
|||
Re: A good spot for the miles dyson?
the problem is that people do take free cards if you try to c/r the turn. Plus if the club drops you are in a tough spot whether or not to c/r. If there are 3-clubs on the board after the turn you probably don't want 3 bets to go in unless you are full.
So if you bet-3-bet the flop he can't take a free card, and if he bluffs his flush draw again you can 3-bet the turn. I think when OOP it is important to power through those flops when villain very likely has a draw. |
#12
|
|||
|
|||
Re: A good spot for the miles dyson?
If he had CC'ed preflop then I absolutely 3b the flop. But the fact the he 3-bet preflop makes club draws so much less of his range, especially since the Qc is on the board. And if he did 3-bet something other than AcKc preflop (which is also betting the turn a bunch, imo), he's so aggro as to be much less likely to take the free card, especially given the pot size...
|
#13
|
|||
|
|||
Re: A good spot for the miles dyson?
[ QUOTE ]
If he had CC'ed preflop then I absolutely 3b the flop. But the fact the he 3-bet preflop makes club draws so much less of his range, especially since the Qc is on the board. And if he did 3-bet something other than AcKc preflop (which is also betting the turn a bunch, imo), he's so aggro as to be much less likely to take the free card, especially given the pot size... [/ QUOTE ] Its been my experience that people rarely take the free card after you raise the flop aswell. I want to 3 bet the flop because with QQ I can 3 bet the turn or c/r vs a cap, but with AA I cant. |
#14
|
|||
|
|||
Re: A good spot for the miles dyson?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] If he had CC'ed preflop then I absolutely 3b the flop. But the fact the he 3-bet preflop makes club draws so much less of his range, especially since the Qc is on the board. And if he did 3-bet something other than AcKc preflop (which is also betting the turn a bunch, imo), he's so aggro as to be much less likely to take the free card, especially given the pot size... [/ QUOTE ] Its been my experience that people rarely take the free card after you raise the flop aswell. I want to 3 bet the flop because with QQ I can 3 bet the turn or c/r vs a cap, but with AA I cant. [/ QUOTE ] Interestingly, this is my exact rationale for NOT 3betting the flop with QQ... |
#15
|
|||
|
|||
Re: A good spot for the miles dyson?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] If he had CC'ed preflop then I absolutely 3b the flop. But the fact the he 3-bet preflop makes club draws so much less of his range, especially since the Qc is on the board. And if he did 3-bet something other than AcKc preflop (which is also betting the turn a bunch, imo), he's so aggro as to be much less likely to take the free card, especially given the pot size... [/ QUOTE ] Its been my experience that people rarely take the free card after you raise the flop aswell. I want to 3 bet the flop because with QQ I can 3 bet the turn or c/r vs a cap, but with AA I cant. [/ QUOTE ] Interestingly, this is my exact rationale for NOT 3betting the flop with QQ... [/ QUOTE ] because you dont think he puts in further action with AA or KK? |
#16
|
|||
|
|||
Re: A good spot for the miles dyson?
There are a lot of turns (i.e. this one) where a guy with AA/KK will slow down on the turn if I 3b the flop. JJ-88 also can get away cheaply.
|
#17
|
|||
|
|||
Re: A good spot for the miles dyson?
but if he has AA or KK you are going to get a ton of action anyway. What I don't want is to miss action against KJs, AJs, ATs, AKs, etc all that are well within a lot players pf 3-betting range. Also all of those hands might raise the flop and take a free card on the turn.
If I 3-bet the flop AA or KK are going to either cap (and I can c/r the turn) or wait and raise the turn so I can 3-bet. The only hands I'm worried about not getting enough action from are the flush draws. So that is why I play it fast. More action from big hands, more action from draws when I'm out of position. |
#18
|
|||
|
|||
Re: A good spot for the miles dyson?
I see what you're saying. I suppose it would have helped if I had included a read in OP (LAGGY - Bad LAGATG, IIRC), but was never worried about giving a free card for the reasons mentioned above. I may be passing up a tiny bit of action vs. AA/KK, but I think I get just as much, if not more from FD, and definitely more from AQ/JJ-88. The only hands I'm costing myself a ton from are 44 and 55, and these are less likely both given card distribution and given that he 3-bet pre.
|
#19
|
|||
|
|||
Re: A good spot for the miles dyson?
[ QUOTE ]
There are a lot of turns (i.e. this one) where a guy with AA/KK will slow down on the turn if I 3b the flop. JJ-88 also can get away cheaply. [/ QUOTE ] JJ-88 get away cheaply when you b/c, c/r (they should at least since this line is ~never a bluff). everyone shows down JJ-88 when you 3-bet the flop. vs. AA/KK you'll pretty much never get more than 3 bets on the turn and river when you take this line. on a turn blank, he will usually correctly place your hand range as AA-QQ. on a 9, T, or J turn, he can include 99, TT, or JJ respectively. on a club turn, he can include AcJc, AcKc. there's just no way you'll represent a hand against which he should 3-bet the turn. 3-betting the flop almost insures you making more off of AA (either he caps flop or calls and raises turn), and many will give you more action even with KK. i mean, when he calls the flop and raises the turn with AA, that's an additional 1.5 big bets compared to your line. |
#20
|
|||
|
|||
Re: A good spot for the miles dyson?
[ QUOTE ]
vs. AA/KK you'll pretty much never get more than 3 bets on the turn and river when you take this line. [/ QUOTE ] Villain had AA in this hand. Edit: Against a more competent opponent, I agree that 3-betting the flop is better - against a guy who will A) never take a free card and B) spew (which was my read on the villain. Like I said, I wasn't interested in flop play when I posted the hand...) I still think my line is best vs. his range. |
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|