A4 in BB (Live)

[Hattifnatt]

Live tournament at local club.

buy-in: $470
Entries: 18
start stack: 10k

Prices:
1: $3800
2: $2300
3: $1500

7 players left and avg stack is 25.7k.

I (BB) have 27k and Villian (Button) is the shortstack with 7k. The other players have 15-35k.

blinds: 400/800, 50 ante

Preflop: Hero is BB with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
4 folds, Villian pushes for 7k, SB folds, Hero..?

Do you make this call?

I think Villians range is very wide here and that I probably have about ~50% vs it so a call is obv +chipEV.

However, Villian is a dangereous opponent that I dont want to double up, but on the other hand it would be great to eliminate him. Another aspect is that if I fold I have more than avarage but if I call and lose I go down to 20k. The hurt of losing 7k is obv much bigger for me than the good things about increasing by about the same amount. Also, I almost never have more than 60% even if I am a favourite.

If you think I am off in my reasoning above plz eloborate in what way.

[willperkins]

I fold in this spot.

1. Villian's M is 5 so he his looking for a spot to push, however, he can look at 6 more hands before he has to really get serious about shoving.

2. You are about 55% to win against a random hand, but villian is saying he has a better than random hand.

3. With and M 0f 17, I would have to have A8 or better to make this call.

IMHO

[betgo]

I call. You are putting in 42% of the money and you are 53% against a top 40% hand.

Incidently, you are 60% against a random hand, unlike what the other poster said.

You are gamble a portion of your stack, but you can afford it. I wouldn't mind knocking out a good player and getting closer to the money.

[Hattifnatt]

or something in between..

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 56.730% 54.73% 02.00% 13776739008 502613718.00 { A4o }
Hand 1: 43.270% 41.27% 02.00% 10388902356 502613718.00 { random }

[betgo]

I did it for A8 rather than A4. A4 is closer.

[Hattifnatt]

Any more opinions?

[BarryLyndon]

I can see villain making this play with a sufficient % of his hands in order to make this call, but it's close and if you feel like you can play well against the players to your left, I think you can find a fold. Also, is it possible that somebody else does the dirty work for you here?

[hamnegger]

fold i hate ace rag its a 1 card hand too often

[levAA]

pot odds 1:1,22
odds against random 1,31:1
odds against top 60% 1,06:1
odds against top 40% 1:1,10

so if he pushes top 40% (44+, A2s+, K2s+, Q4s+, J7s+, T7s+, 97s+, 87s, A3o+, K7o+, Q8o+, J8o+, T9o) this is still slightily +cEV

I would call here for 2 reasons:

1.) the possibility to eliminate a dangerous opponent with acceptable risk (7k from your 27k stack) weights much more for me, than the risk to double him up.

2.) Making calls like this - even when you loose it - gives you more respect when you are in the BB.

So here we have a slightly +cEV situation with 2 bonuses imo - so i'd call.

[BarryLyndon]

[ QUOTE ]
pot odds 1:1,22
odds against random 1,31:1
odds against top 60% 1,06:1
odds against top 40% 1:1,10

so if he pushes top 40% (44+, A2s+, K2s+, Q4s+, J7s+, T7s+, 97s+, 87s, A3o+, K7o+, Q8o+, J8o+, T9o) this is still slightily +cEV

I would call here for 2 reasons:

1.) the possibility to eliminate a dangerous opponent with acceptable risk (7k from your 27k stack) weights much more for me, than the risk to double him up.

2.) Making calls like this - even when you loose it - gives you more respect when you are in the BB.

So here we have a slightly +cEV situation with 2 bonuses imo - so i'd call.

[/ QUOTE ]

I tend to disagree here. If I have 27K and a dangerous opponent has 7K, the blinds are manageable, I want to let go of a hand that almost always is only going to be only slightly +cEV. I want to suffocate the 7K stack as long as possible. At the same time, he's gonna put other players on tilt, while we know better. Keeping him around with a marginal stack is good for table entropy, assuming that we know how to handle it.

I guess I'm speaking from SNG experience here. If a good player starts pushbotting with a stack .5 mine and we're close to ITM (I play 6-max, so say, 4 or 3 players), I love to let a pushbot have his way assuming I have a healthy stack. Someone goes on tilt and me and the pushbot have a a little feast. Or the pushbot cleans a little house, and then I get him heads down like 1.5:1 or something. That doesn't mean I don't spread my calling range against him. However, the last thing I want to do is call him down too light and let him get too many chips so that he starts to cause me an inordinate amount of grief.

Barry