C-betting survey.

[well named]

[ QUOTE ]
I bet less often when I'm OOP - 5 23%

Expected this to be higher.

[/ QUOTE ]

This surprised me as well. Against only one opponent my frequency OOP doesn't go down very much really, flop texture is a larger factor, but I'm wondering what the theory is behind betting more frequently OOP?

[DaycareInferno]

sometimes you're better off checking behind marginal hands versus agressive opponents on the flop. can't do that oop.

[NL Newbie]

I cbet less into fish who call way to much, i cbet more when i hit and boards drawy.

I cbet less on monotone occasionally.

that is all

[whyzze]

Hard to properly answer those questions.

A few things go into when I cbet and one that was not mentioned here is image. My bet sizes never change in relation to pot size unless the pot is very multiway, but then I'm usually not betting air.


I think the most important things are your opponent, your image, your position, and board texture to a lesser extent.

[well named]

[ QUOTE ]
sometimes you're better off checking behind marginal hands versus agressive opponents on the flop. can't do that oop.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm probably being dense, but even though I agree with the premise, I don't understand how it leads to the conclusion that you should c-bet more often OOP. Assuming an aggressive opponent, my normal inclination would be to c-bet less often with air OOP because I can't handle a raise (although again I don't think it would be a drastic adjustment, and of course other factors are weightier than position against one opponent, IMO)

[thing85]

Against weak opponents, I often like a c/r when I'm OOP (when villain donkbets the min bet or 2xBB). Obviously, you can't do this often, but it works well against the right players.

[Gelford]

Pokey, some tend to vary their betsizes based on board texture (usually ranging from half to full pot), it seems that your underlying model fails to consider this. (I assume, that you have some sort of underlying model here and not just asking cbet questions at random)

On a similar note, there is a big difference between JT9 monotone and Q82 monotone

[br.bm]

against unknown villians I c-bet 99% of the time from any position on any flop.
The size is usually 2/3. Sometime I'd like to establish a donkey image and bet 3/2 pot. When I have a draw I may block with a 1/4 to 1/2 pot bet.

History can change everything, though. Esp. on paired boards.


My reasoning to cbet almost always is the following:
Lets say the calling range from villian is:
{22-JJ, AJ+, JT+}

Any given flop will miss him more then half the time.
Let's say I always loose if he calls and he calls half the time:
EV of cbet = 50% * (1Pot) - 50% * (2/3*Pot) = +1/6 Pot

[kurto]

Someone probably mentioned this but... the survey doesn't factor in number of opponents. If I'm playing at a table where 3 people call my raise, my C-bet frequency drops tremendously.

It also doesn't take into account flop texture (other then monotone flops)

Also- regarding whether I cbet OOP-- headsup I may cbet more OOP, but against multiple players far less.

When I vary my Cbet size, it has more to do with factors you haven't listed: namely, how big is the pot? How many players are there? And stacksizes-- if I bet a little more, can I get someone's stack in more easily?

[KEW]

[ QUOTE ]
Someone probably mentioned this but... the survey doesn't factor in number of opponents. If I'm playing at a table where 3 people call my raise, my C-bet frequency drops tremendously.

It also doesn't take into account flop texture (other then monotone flops)

Also- regarding whether I cbet OOP-- headsup I may cbet more OOP, but against multiple players far less.

When I vary my Cbet size, it has more to do with factors you haven't listed: namely, how big is the pot? How many players are there? And stacksizes-- if I bet a little more, can I get someone's stack in more easily?

[/ QUOTE ]

All question are vs one villain..

I agree with everthing you said..

I found I could not answer most of the survey because vs 1 villain I will c-bet nearly 100% of the time...Factors that affect bet size and the time I do not are a combination of all factors listed in the survey..Survey compare tight vs aggro but tight can be aggro should tight vs loose and aggro vs passive..Ex vs a passive villain I will vary my bets sizes based on my hand and make smaller blocking bets to allow me to draw cheaply(not fearing a raise)..Stack sizes is also of great importance...