family issue, and personal philosophy

[Ben Young]

Ok, so this post is in two main parts, the first about issues with my family, and my religion, the second about my personal philosophy. For the first, I am seeking advice, and for both, general discussion. Also, I'd like to know if there's a name for the personal philosophy I attempt to describe.

Part I:

My mother, father, and my brother are devout Methodist Christians. I was until around the age of 13, though I had been harboring disagreements with what I was being told in church for years before that. I refused to be confirmed at whatever age that was supposed to happen. My parents were fine with this. However they made me go to church every week still. I soon rejected Christianity(I think around the age of 15). I need to backtrack a little, as it is extremely relevant. In eighth grade, I developed a medical condition, which has since been properly diagnosed as Myoclonic Dystonia, but was misdiagnosed at the time, and I thus had a bone removed from my foot, which did not fix the problem. I am now 18. Ever since, I have been in near constant pain, and aggravated by tics from the myoclonus part of the dystonia. Both necessitating me to take heavy medication. Initially, my rejection of Christianity stemmed from my disagreements with things preached by the Bible and those who embraced the Bible, and my resentment against God for giving me this ailment. With the Bible stuff I just mentioned, I did not believe in a discriminatory God, who punished homosexuals for embracing their sexuality, and I did not believe that there was only one 'correct' religion. In the last quarter of my freshman year, I was home schooled, due to medical issues, and one of my tutors was a nice Catholic woman, who went to church every day. She taught me bio. I would talk to her a lot about religion, and the stuff that was happening to me, and I asked her why God would do this to me, or allow this to happen to me, and much worse things to other people, and she insinuated that God may be using me as an example. This pissed me off. I floated around religiously, for about two years, between (none of this is a joke) wicca, rastafarianism, atheism, and agnosticism, then back to atheism. About two years ago, I had been wallowing in depression, and suicidal thoughts, and a suicide attempt, I bounced back momentarily, but then started falling back into the same mind state, when by chance I came upon a simple phrase, a teaching of Buddhism, that attachment is the cause of all suffering. This was the truest thing I had ever read, and helped me start to let go of the things that were causing me intense grief. I now consider myself for the most part, a devout Buddhist. I say 'for the most part' because my take on Buddhism is that it is a tool to help people find their own road to enlightenment, and the end of suffering. I am open with my family about this. My father and I had a great relationship(it's still good, but decaying), and he told me, with sincerity, that his greatest fear is that I will never be saved. It hurts him to know that I am not a Christian, but I think deep down he also thinks that I am either striving for attention, or lying, trying to be defiant, neither of which is the case. It hurts me to be forced by him to attend church services weekly. His contention is that I owe it to him because he pays for my college. Now granted, it is $42,000 a year. So I comply, but let him know my angst. I want to be able to maintain a healthy relationship with my father, without our religions having an impact on it.

Part II:

My personal philosophy, is above all, to come to peace, end suffering, fade away, etc, in enlightenment. However, I don't deny that God exists in any form that is perpetuated by modern religions, or otherwise. I do not worship God, though. I feel that I have no obligation to do so, that if I was created, it was knowing I had the potential for complete independent thought, so I should not be punished for it. I could ramble on, but basically, I believe that even if there is a God, I should not serve him/her. Is there a name for this?

Thanks

[MidGe]

[ QUOTE ]
Is there a name for this?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, a moral and rational position. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Lestat]

I mean no disrespect, but what I get from your post is that you're someone who NEEDS to believe in something. I suspect it's the result of your early religious upbringing that perhaps taught you life is meaningless without religious belief. You have since sought out many beliefs and bounced back and forth until you finally found something you can believe in and feel good about. If this is the only way to find meaning in your life then go with it.

Personally, I think the problem is your NEED to find a religious belief as the only thing which will give your life meaning, but it's people like you why religion is a $$billion a year global business! I don't think it hurts to believe in whatever makes you happy.

[soon2bepro]

Buddhism isn't a religion, it's just a popular philosophy of life. You may call it a non-teist religion, but it really defeats the point. There is no real separation from Buddhism to philosophy other than the fact that there are many people who agree on the same thing (on each branch of
Buddhism).

Buddhism is not a business, and even if it is somewhere in the world it's not by enforcing donations on ignorant believiers like most religions do.

Yes, Ben Young needs a philosophy and he found one. Whats wrong with that?

[Lestat]

<font color="blue"> Yes, Ben Young needs a philosophy and he found one. Whats wrong with that? </font>

Not a thing. In fact I'm glad, since I just learned something about Buddihism. Thanks.

[godBoy]

[ QUOTE ]
attachment is the cause of all suffering.

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't you feel attachment to all those you love?, or do you think personal fulfillment is more important?

[BluffTHIS!]

Hi Ben,

I think you know from my postings here what I believe, i.e. catholic christianity. And I think you have a wrong view of christianity, partially due no doubt to being raised christian, but not really being formed as a christian and understanding the basis for its beliefs. But the core concept is that we all are children of God, and that as great as His justice is, His Divine Mercy is even greater, and that we were not created for this life primarily, but for the one to come after. Part of what you are discussing involves the problem of evil and suffering that I discuss some in the other thread. It mainly as I said there involves free will. And like that tutor told you, christians do see redemptive and spiritual value in patient suffering, though that seems just a platitude to most. And I have said that I believe that whatever is good and true in another religion, which doesn't possess the full truth, must nonetheless come from God. Thus the Buddhist teaching on suffering actually has resonance with christian teachings on being attached to either material possessions or persons or habits, rather than mainly to God.

And since we view this life as a gateway to the afterlife, then the subject of death has a lot of meaning, not only for being the doorway, but also for how we should live this life. Again Buddhism has many parallels, and a true gem for its view of death and its implications for this life is Warrior of Zen: The Diamond Hard Widsom Mind of Suzuki Shosan. I have always had an interest in philosphical Buddhism and Taoism, and recommend that book highly to you.

You also speak of being turned off by christianity because of its teachings on homosexuality and divine punishment. But God does not condemn a person for an attraction, but only for acts that are prohibited where there is no contrition or minimal attempts to not to repeat same in the future. And all this is part of a larger package and can't be separated out. I don't think you really understand what christianity is about, and if you would like to, then let Jesus speak to you directly by reading the gospels.

But if you want to remain a Buddhist, then be a good Buddhist, and not someone who just picks some convenient parts of that belief system (there are of course several different sects of Buddhism). One is not a Buddhist or a Christian by either subscribing to certain beliefs or merely professing to be same, but by living a Buddhist or a Christian life. And living that life doesn't mean living it perfectly, but just striving for that perfection and having a dertermination to begin again when one falters.

I hope that you are able to come to believe that this life is worth living both for itself, and for the future one to come (or Nirvana).

[soon2bepro]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
attachment is the cause of all suffering.

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't you feel attachment to all those you love?, or do you think personal fulfillment is more important?

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course you feel attachment to those you love. And yes that can lead to suffering. What Buddhism teaches is that suffering is derived from attachment. As in, when you're attached, you're vulnerable and can be hurt depending on the situation. When you let go of things nothing can hurt you anymore. Basically, if you don't care, you won't suffer.

Buddhism is IMO a philosophy about becoming pretty much a "worker ant" (only much more intellectually capable). The basic idea is to lose purpose in life, bit by bit, while mantaining general rules of ethics, just for the sake of good convivence.

The final goal of all Buddhists, though, is to get to a constant state of Nirvana, which is basically losing your individuality, letting your mind wander without caring if you're still breathing or not. Needless to say, this theoretical state will lead to death very quickly. Most people who are into this usually reach Nirvana from time to time, but their basic instincts sooner or later kick in.

[MidGe]

[ QUOTE ]
The final goal of all Buddhists, though, is to get to a constant state of Nirvana, which is basically losing your individuality, letting your mind wander without caring if you're still breathing or not. Needless to say, this theoretical state will lead to death very quickly. Most people who are into this usually reach Nirvana from time to time, but their basic instincts sooner or later kick in.

[/ QUOTE ]

FYI, the canonical final goal of Buddhism is the eradication ("pulling out by the root", and therefore no possibility of growth back) of greed, hate and ignorance within one's psychology. BTW, those three terms have very specific and larger meaning than attributed in the common english use of language.

[Ben Young]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
attachment is the cause of all suffering.

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't you feel attachment to all those you love?, or do you think personal fulfillment is more important?

[/ QUOTE ]

I feel attachment to those I love yes, and I don't value personal fulfillment, or at least, I try not to. Attachment is the cause of suffering, but suffering is not the only thing that results from attachment. Also, I don't think love and attachment need to interweave nearly as deeply and directly as suffering and attachment do.