AK w flush draw.

Alexost · #1 07-18-2007, 12:43 AM

PokerStars 0.50/1.00 Hold'em (10 handed) Hand History converter Courtesy of PokerZion.com
Preflop: Hero is MP2 with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls, 1 fold, Hero raises, 2 folds, Button calls, SB calls, 1 fold, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls.

Flop: (13 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (6 players)
SB checks, UTG checks, UTG+1 checks, UTG+2 checks, Hero bets, Button calls, SB calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 calls.

Turn: (9 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, UTG checks, UTG+2 checks, Hero bets, Button folds, SB folds, UTG raises, UTG+2 folds, Hero calls.

River: (13 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
UTG bets, Hero raises, UTG calls.

Final Pot: 17 BB

So after this hand villain gets angry and says nice suck out. Do you guys agree? I thought If you have odds to draw, which i most certainly did, it's not considered a suck out. True? Any opinions on the play?

Gib · #2 07-18-2007, 12:45 AM

I take the free card on the turn, other than that it's fine

00Snitch · #3 07-18-2007, 12:53 AM

Betting the turn is silly because giving anyone a free card cannot hurt you ever (assuming your AKui will never win at showdown vs 4 opponents on a co-ordinated board).

On the flip-side, getting a free card can help you lots.

cold_cash · #4 07-18-2007, 12:54 AM

how come you bet the turn?

Point Blank · #5 07-18-2007, 12:56 AM

how but value do you think your hand has on the turn vs this crowd (and getting called by all but one) ...
two overs + nut flush draw
do you have a reason to bet

IMO this is a standard free card spot

bennyhana · #6 07-18-2007, 12:59 AM

The more I think about it the more I like it. you played your hand well, and he didn't.

Edit: I'm torn between taking the free card and the huge semi bluff here. My first thought seriously was taking the free card, but the more I thought about it I wasn't sure. I guess I would have to be at the table. I think auto betting turns like this is a huge leak, but making bluffs like that aren't all bad.

As far as the moran at the table, who gives a [censored] what he thinks.

bozlax · #7 07-18-2007, 01:01 AM

1. You got offered a free card on the turn with an unmade hand. Take it.

2. Don't listen to retards that tell you that you just sucked out on them.

3. Don't post hands here that you won simply to vindicate your play.

Edit: you're a noob, so to explain #3: this is what the NC thread is for. Your question has no strategic basis; you show us your hand and say, "This guy says I sucked out, did I?" If you have a question about how you played the hand, stop the action where you have a question and ask it.

Alexost · #8 07-18-2007, 01:16 AM

[ QUOTE ]
1. You got offered a free card on the turn with an unmade hand. Take it.

2. Don't listen to retards that tell you that you just sucked out on them.

3. Don't post hands here that you won simply to vindicate your play.

Edit: you're a noob, so to explain #3: this is what the NC thread is for. Your question has no strategic basis; you show us your hand and say, "This guy says I sucked out, did I?" If you have a question about how you played the hand, stop the action where you have a question and ask it.

[/ QUOTE ]

1) This is info I need. I need to look at the turn bet, I'm new and don't see what that means at all yet.

2) I didn't take it personally. I really would like to know: If you have correct drawing odds, is it still considered a suck out?

3) I am definitely not trying to vindicate my play. I had a legitimate question and posted my hand so it was easy to see.

Can you please explain the turn bet mistake in more detail.

Thanks

Point Blank · #9 07-18-2007, 01:18 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
1. You got offered a free card on the turn with an unmade hand. Take it.

2. Don't listen to retards that tell you that you just sucked out on them.

3. Don't post hands here that you won simply to vindicate your play.

Edit: you're a noob, so to explain #3: this is what the NC thread is for. Your question has no strategic basis; you show us your hand and say, "This guy says I sucked out, did I?" If you have a question about how you played the hand, stop the action where you have a question and ask it.

[/ QUOTE ]

1) This is info I need. I need to look at the turn bet, I'm new and don't see what that means at all yet.

2) I didn't take it personally. I really would like to know: If you have correct drawing odds, is it still considered a suck out?

3) I am definitely not trying to vindicate my play. I had a legitimate question and posted my hand so it was easy to see.

Can you please explain the turn bet mistake in more detail.

Thanks

[/ QUOTE ]

think about why you bet it and you'll see (also, in some situations it might still be OK to bet it)

00Snitch · #10 07-18-2007, 01:20 AM

[ QUOTE ]

1. You got offered a free card on the turn with an unmade hand in a big pot with a great draw. Take it.

[/ QUOTE ]

edit: forgot to say FYP!! [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Benny, I don't think there is much "bluff" in this "semi-bluf".

You can't consider a bet into 4 opponents on a co-ordinated board a bluff? You're probably not going to get raised too often, which is good, but you will almost never take this down. Plus, if a made flush, straight, set, 2pair or pair (actually, that is all made hands [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]) offer you a free card here, that is so so awsome I nearly wet myself.

There may be some argument on the value side of things, there may be some argument on the cleaning outs side of things. However, I doubt you will get enough callers to exploit an equity edge, and if someone is calling the flop with A8/6/3 (obv without A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ldo), there is a fair chance they will peal the turn too.