2/4 stud hi, what the hay!!???

[Bremen]

I feel dirty dirty dirty. Weird hand all round, I also played very poorly I feel.

7 Card Stud High ($2/$4), Ante $0.25, Bring-In $1 (converter)

3rd Street - (1.00 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___calls___calls
Seat 2: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___folds
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___raises___calls
Seat 4: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___raises
Seat 5: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 6: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 7: xx xx 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___brings-in___folds
Seat 8: xx xx 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds

4th Street - (9.50 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___raises
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___bets___calls
Seat 4: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls___calls
Seat 5: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls___calls

5th Street - (12.75 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___checks
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___checks
Seat 4: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___checks
Seat 5: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___checks

6th Street - (12.75 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___bets
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___checks___calls
Seat 4: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___checks___calls
Seat 5: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___checks___folds

River - (15.75 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] xx___bets
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___checks___calls
Seat 4: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] xx___checks___calls

Total pot: (18.75 BB)

[Andy B]

I think you played third perfectly. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] When J8 raises, he could have trips, two pair, an open-ender, brain damage, etc. I think three-betting would have been fine. I think calling and betting out on fifth would have been fine. And I even think that the chicken-call is OK. When it gets checked through on fifth, though, it sure looks like Kings-up is boss. Definitely bet sixth. As played, I think chicken-calling the river is OK.

[davebwell]

Let me try to do some analysis here. (For more my own good probably more than for anyone else) Rip away if you think I'm out of line.

Seat 1's 4th street raise following the 3rd street action seems odd. maybe trip jacks. I doubt he has trips when he takes the free card on 5th street as the bets double. On 6th street you caught one of seat 4's 8s and seat 5 has one showing- eliminating trip 8s. Seat 1 probably has Jacks up or a 4 flush. With all the hearts, Jacks and 8s on the board, he is drawing pretty slim. I think I would lead 6th. As played when everyone else checks 6th, I would raise seat 1's bet trying to get seats 4 and 5 to fold or at least make seat 4 pay to chase Aces up (if he had aces or hasn't already improved to aces up). If seat 4 stayed, chicken call the river if seat 1 even bets after you check-raised him on 6th..

[LandonM]

Ugh.
This is precisely why I do not play these levels where no one ever folds. It's like blackjack. Everyone may as well just ante $20 to start, be dealt 7 cards, then turn them over to see who wins.

A few years back, my roll was about down to the green after a horribly icey wave of cards and a nightmare spate of bad beats at NLHE. I went back to stud to grind back up and rightly decided that it was better to felt 1/4 of my entire roll to sit at the higher levels than to play the "roll appropriate" no-fold'em circle-of-hell lower levels.

[SCSTWG]

On 4th, when you come out betting after pairing your doorcard, I think you have to give Seat 1 credit for trip 8's or two pair. I don't put him on a strait draw since he called 2 raises on 3rd and it doesn't seem like a good spot to try and buy a free card. If he has J' and 8's, I think it is a bad bet, but you already know him to be a bad player because the only hand he should have called 2 raises by an Ace and a King with is rolled-up J's.

I don't know how this hand played out, but you certainly want to keep playing with him at your table.

[Brad1970]

[ QUOTE ]
Ugh.
This is precisely why I do not play these levels where no one ever folds. It's like blackjack. Everyone may as well just ante $20 to start, be dealt 7 cards, then turn them over to see who wins.

A few years back, my roll was about down to the green after a horribly icey wave of cards and a nightmare spate of bad beats at NLHE. I went back to stud to grind back up and rightly decided that it was better to felt 1/4 of my entire roll to sit at the higher levels than to play the "roll appropriate" no-fold'em circle-of-hell lower levels.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol. good analogy.

[cgrohman]

Totally agreed. I vote for brain damage.

[MrBlueNose]

[ QUOTE ]
Ugh.
This is precisely why I do not play these levels where no one ever folds. It's like blackjack. Everyone may as well just ante $20 to start, be dealt 7 cards, then turn them over to see who wins.

A few years back, my roll was about down to the green after a horribly icey wave of cards and a nightmare spate of bad beats at NLHE. I went back to stud to grind back up and rightly decided that it was better to felt 1/4 of my entire roll to sit at the higher levels than to play the "roll appropriate" no-fold'em circle-of-hell lower levels.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for making my day!

[MRBAA]

Well put and may have worked for you but...I doubt you will ever have a higher long term win rate than in games where players are very loose and very passive, as this one appears to have been. Yes, you will take some truly amazing beats -- I've had rolled aces beaten by baby straights etc. and so on. You may not even feel like you're winning that much (and in absolute dollars you may not be) but when you compute your win rate over time, you will find it's very high.

[benlj21]

I make it a point in any variant of stud not to give a free card on 5th when I have a hand that is even half as good as this. also when an J and a second 8 come on 6th i would gain a lot of confidence in my hand.