Folding Queens preflop???

[reef2287]

unknown, all i'm asking is why can't we add 10-10 and jj in there too? it looks like an iso play and he knows that we could raise with a wide range of hands and can only call down a push with very few, with all that dead money in the pot i see him doing this more lose, there is a possibility with kk but i don't get why everyone sees this spot as an instafold-- just some guidance would be nice for a newb/ donk like myself

[Unknown Soldier]

oops should probably read op before commenting didnt realise utg was all-in [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

I think i might call this now, close since it's 160bbs deep 100, and im snap-calling. You're right, his range opens up now

[Ringmaster]

I guess no one uses Poker Stove anymore... [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

[ QUOTE ]
Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

54,793,728 games 0.015 secs 3,652,915,200 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 50.098% 48.39% 01.70% 26516414 934028.00 { QcQd }
Hand 1: 49.902% 48.20% 01.70% 26409258 934028.00 { AdAh, AdAs, AhAs, KK-JJ, AKs, AKo }


[/ QUOTE ]

IMO his range could be wider than this. Add TT and it becomes a clear call.

[martijn]

is this the kind of player that knows you could be isolating the guy who shoved for 4.5bb?
or is he a abc tag who just plays his cards, I think this is a pretty big difference in your judgement.

[reef2287]

thats what i was thinking after re-reading it, just wanted to make sure thats not a huge leak in my game or anything because your opinion + EV/> versus mine

[cityburke]

Why is everyone trying to rationalise the play of someone making such a huge overshove. The villains shove is bad with any holding he could have. This is KK+ like 90% in my opinion from someone who isn't comfortable with big pairs semi deep post flop.

[reef2287]

big pairs semi deep? the raise was a typical 3-bet trying to take down the 8 dollars in the pot for free with position, if hes good hes re-raising with so many hands because we call very few, kk is a possibility but not at all 90 percent and not an all-in, this screams ak to me or jj

[aislephive]

[ QUOTE ]
big pairs semi deep? the raise was a typical 3-bet trying to take down the 8 dollars in the pot for free with position, if hes good hes re-raising with so many hands because we call very few, kk is a possibility but not at all 90 percent and not an all-in, this screams ak to me or jj

[/ QUOTE ]

Nobody who is competent is iso shoving 150bbs more on top of an isolation reraise with TT/JJ or even QQ. AK is also not very likely this deep.

What does TT/JJ/QQ expect to be called by when the shove for 150bbs more? It's just a case where worse hands rarely call and better hands rarely fold.

This is AA/KK from a solid player quite often IMO.

[holdem2000]

Full ring game I'd instafold this, maybe I'd need to mutter to myself for ten seconds first if I'm in a tilty mood. I haven't played 6max in a long time so maybe you can consider a call, but in my experience your typical half-decent to decent player has only AA/KK and maybe AK here (the occasional QQ too maybe), and I only see weak players pushing lower pairs. *Maybe* some very good players with a good read on you push with some lower pairs too, but even then I'd be surprised when you're ahead.

Edit: A player pushing, say, JJ would probably just as easilly push 22 - he knows if you call you either have QQ+ or AK. Hopefully if you were with this type of villain you'd have seen him make a move like this already.

[skiier04]

Well as you can see I folded SB had AA and beat UTG's J9... I gave myself a pat on the back and moved on.

Sounds like most agree on a fold so I like my decision.