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#41
12-03-2006, 06:42 PM
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Re: To Catch a Predator: Creating Crime
That's my general thinking here also. I think many are being arrested because they are willing to have sex with a minor, and I'm not sure how likely it is that they would actually have sex with a minor. Maybe some go to the house and figure they'll make their mind up there. Others are probably genuine predators that made up their mind a long time ago. You also don't know that the fake minor actually would have sex with them either. Hanging out with a kid isn't illegal. It's definitely got more grey area than your typical undercover arrest, which are for 'false' crimes that have basically been completed (accepting fake heroin for money). I think I wish PJ would actually take it further than house entry. Like, the guys who actually stripped naked in the house, I'm more comfortable arresting him.
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#43
12-03-2006, 06:54 PM
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Re: To Catch a Predator: Creating Crime
[ QUOTE ]
We know how the courts have come down on this, Copernicus. It's more a discussion of if we agree with the interpretation and existing law. [/ QUOTE ] that isnt obvious from some of the responses here, especially when it isnt acknowledged that this kind of sting happens for all types of crimes.
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#44
12-03-2006, 06:58 PM
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Re: To Catch a Predator: Creating Crime
[ QUOTE ]
Muggings...decoys are often used in high crime areas to capture muggings. No victim, talking to an adult is ok, etc: In many undercover situations there is no possibility of actually committing the crime. A decoy prostitute wont really give you sex, [/ QUOTE ] Except the "crime" the johns are charged with is invariably *solicitation*, which is an action that is actually comitted (though there is no victim, and hence, no crime). I thought you were saying these were "real" crimes, now you're saying there's "no possibility" of the crime being committed. Which is it? [ QUOTE ] a briefcase full of drugs may actually contain lactose, a crate full of guns may contain toys, [/ QUOTE ] But these aren't crimes *anyway* since again, there's no victim. [ QUOTE ] a briefcase full of bribe money may contain newspapers. [/ QUOTE ] Who's the victim here? (hint: this is a trick question!)
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#45
12-03-2006, 07:34 PM
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Re: To Catch a Predator: Creating Crime
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Muggings...decoys are often used in high crime areas to capture muggings. No victim, talking to an adult is ok, etc: In many undercover situations there is no possibility of actually committing the crime. A decoy prostitute wont really give you sex, [/ QUOTE ] Except the "crime" the johns are charged with is invariably *solicitation*, which is an action that is actually comitted (though there is no victim, and hence, no crime). I thought you were saying these were "real" crimes, now you're saying there's "no possibility" of the crime being committed. Which is it? [ QUOTE ] a briefcase full of drugs may actually contain lactose, a crate full of guns may contain toys, [/ QUOTE ] But these aren't crimes *anyway* since again, there's no victim. [ QUOTE ] a briefcase full of bribe money may contain newspapers. [/ QUOTE ] Who's the victim here? (hint: this is a trick question!) [/ QUOTE ] the point is they are all prosecuted for crimes based on intent, even though the actual crime could never have been carried to fruition.
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#46
12-04-2006, 12:56 AM
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Re: To Catch a Predator: Creating Crime
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Muggings...decoys are often used in high crime areas to capture muggings. No victim, talking to an adult is ok, etc: In many undercover situations there is no possibility of actually committing the crime. A decoy prostitute wont really give you sex, [/ QUOTE ] Except the "crime" the johns are charged with is invariably *solicitation*, which is an action that is actually comitted (though there is no victim, and hence, no crime). I thought you were saying these were "real" crimes, now you're saying there's "no possibility" of the crime being committed. Which is it? [ QUOTE ] a briefcase full of drugs may actually contain lactose, a crate full of guns may contain toys, [/ QUOTE ] But these aren't crimes *anyway* since again, there's no victim. [ QUOTE ] a briefcase full of bribe money may contain newspapers. [/ QUOTE ] Who's the victim here? (hint: this is a trick question!) [/ QUOTE ] the point is they are all prosecuted for crimes based on intent, even though the actual crime could never have been carried to fruition. [/ QUOTE ] So they are *not* "real crimes," just thoughtcrimes. Agree or disagree?
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#47
12-05-2006, 01:35 AM
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Re: To Catch a Predator: Creating Crime
[ QUOTE ]
Interestingly, over several shows I noticed that they have now added an underage girl in the house who very briefly greets the man. [/ QUOTE ] This is a decoy of legal age. My question is how can they legally show the alleged perpetrators face and name on tv?
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#48
12-05-2006, 03:17 AM
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Re: To Catch a Predator: Creating Crime
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Interestingly, over several shows I noticed that they have now added an underage girl in the house who very briefly greets the man. [/ QUOTE ] This is a decoy of legal age. My question is how can they legally show the alleged perpetrators face and name on tv? [/ QUOTE ] signed releases, lol
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#50
12-05-2006, 03:49 AM
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Re: To Catch a Predator: Creating Crime
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] This is a decoy of legal age. [/ QUOTE ] That's critical. The burden is on the prosecution to prove the defendant believed anything different. [/ QUOTE ] Not a hard one to make. The decoy states their age. The perp keeps talking to them: asks about parents whereabouts, acknowledges they could get in trouble if they got together, etc.
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