Personality traits affect game (long)

[JJNJustin]

I have read a lot of poker literature, and it seems to me that the majority of 2+2 writing has to do with strategy and theory. This is good, and I have found their writings enormously helpful. However, an important part of poker is playing your opponent, and I have seen limited discussion that centers around players being either tough, timid, maniac, etc. Phil Hellmuth's descriptions in his PPLTP book is similiar, although he uses animal similes. In The Psychology of Poker, the author deals with this concept in the most detail extremely well, and this post is sort of along those lines. This information wont benefit internet players, but I am primarily a B&M player, and I find it extremely useful to be able to take advantage of certain players personality traits and how I play against them.

I have three main axis that I use to gauge players, and players are usually on either end or the middle of any given axis. I usually rate players -5, 0, or +5, or somewhere in between, but I play against a -3 the same way I would a -5. Please note that these are primarily personality traits and not necessarily indicators how of good a person plays. Two players with similiar personailty traits may play poorly and well. Here are the three main traits that I see common to all players:

riggidity vs. impulsivity
confidence vs. timidness
misanthropy vs. sensitivity

1. Riggidity- players who are strong on this axis tend to play in very predictable ways. They usually play their hands the same way every time and dont bother to change their game up very much. In their mind, it isnt worth the gamble. They have very little gamble in them, and view poker as an opportunity for them make money, period. They have no interest in being a star player, fame, personal reward, etc. They are typically grinders who are very logical, organized, and altogether boring. They play the game almost without emotion. They are hard to get on tilt because they attach no meaning to the outcome of the hand. They never take a shot at bigger games unless they are trying to move up, and they never gamble just to gamble. Their actions stem from the need to wager with the best of it in order to make money, period. They get no thrill from gambling. They are content to win a bunch of small pots and content to go home a small winner everyday. They are consistent, highly disciplined, and very routine. They typically arrive at the casino the same time every morning and leave the same time every day, win or lose. They shy away from fancy plays. They shy away from playing risky cards unless they are getting long odds. They dress is very functional and they tend to blend in the crowd. They have very rigid thinking about how the game should be played for profit, and usually wont deviate. They dont try to get in their opponents heads, they usually stick to playing their own hands. Because they usually play lots of hours they are usually trying to conserve mental energy and trying to stick to long term strategies rather than dealing with each individual hand. They tend to wholy concerned with their own hand and not anyone elses. They typically regard others' actions as foolish and unnecessary. They are very frugal and cheap. Their playing credo revolves around, "I know what I have, and I dont care what you have."

Impulsive players- these players are the exact opposite of the riggid players. They have a lot of gamble in them. They are usually clever and tricky. They enjoy trying to outmanuever their opponents in a sort of war of wits. They get bored easily and may switch games. They crave action games like O8B, and love playing huge pots. If a game is too tight or passsive, they may get bored and leave. They typically over extend their bankroll in bigger games and may go broke. Their weakness for gambling and action results in bad habits like sports betting and extensive craps sessions. They often believe in luck, wear many lucky charms and jewelry, and are often well groomed as they "feel lucky" when they look their best. They typically wear more flamboyant dress, spend extra money on fashionable hair cuts, shoes, shirts, jewelry, etc. They tend to stand out rather than blend in. They love to chase big draws and take down huge pots on the river card. They play more by instinct and feel then by a set pattern. If they get a sense that you're weak, they'll be quick to steal the pot from you with no hand. If they sense you're strong, some of them can make big laydowns. They like to play "get lucky cards" such as small pairs and suited connectors and win big pots with them. They can get tricky in position and make all kind of fancy plays. They'll gladly 3-bet 33 against a probably AK, partly because they crave action, partly because they can make a good read, and partly because they dont like to waste hands, and partly because they get bored folding too much. They may constantly change seats, ask for new setups, or change tables until they get the "feeling" their looking for. Many of them are thrill seekers and will take unnecessary risks, especially in no-limit. Some of them have substance abuse problems, especially with cocaine or marijuana. They may drink while they play. They like to play the player rather than play the cards. Some of them play extremely loose, and most of them play as loose as they can get away with. They are looking to get lucky after the flop and trap their opponents for many bets. Their strategy revolves around the credo "I know what you have, and you dont know what I have."

If there is any interest in this thread, I will continue
with the other four extremes in follow up replies.

-J

[JJNJustin]

The confident player- this personality trait revolves around a need to be a dominant member of society. They typically are very competitive and strive to be the best at everything they do. This usually translates to playing very good hands, usually favoring high cards, but not necessarily. They wont play junkie cards as these are for losers. They typically have a low opinion of others and can be arrogant. When they play a pot, they are extremely aggressive and usually try to either bet or raise. Forcing them to just call when they dont have the nuts puts them in a precarious position, they hate it. They will usually try to reraise in an attempt to maintain dominance in the hand. Their personality is dominated by a primitive desire for dominance. Some of them may make bad laydowns on the river because they hate losing showdowns, and would rather make a slightly -ev laydown then risk the embarassment and "feeling small" by losing a showdown. They usually play at the highest games they can afford and you usually see them "playing with the big boys" or "playing in the big game." They get a big thrill out of competing with other good players and mistakingly play in these games rather than in more profitable games with weak players. Their actions center around their sense of self-worth, the quality of their hands, and their net winnings. They hate to leave a session stuck, as this would also reduce their feelings of confidence and dominance, and may play many long hours in order to recoup losses. They hate when a bad player gets lucky on them. Whereas riggid players accept the luck factor as the driving force of the game, and impulsive players often rely on the luck factor, competitive-dominant players hate the luck factor because it allows poor playes to catch up to them and win. They, being above the competition, refuse to rely on luck, and hence luck never favors them. They refuse to acknowledge anyone else at the table as being good, but rather, "He's lucky." When they lose with really big hands they often tilt and become hyper aggressive. They are usually the most aggressive players on the table and find any excuse they can to raise. Whereas riggid players usually look for a reason to fold, impulsive players look to call, confident players look to raise. If folding is an impossibility, they will frequently reraise since they have to call, even if they are unsure about their hand. They would rather be the one betting, and they hate checking and calling. They usually have very expensive clothing and cars, and tend to look for the finer things in life. For example, they may drink only cognac and refuse to eat cheap comp food. Their credo seems to be, "My hand is always better than yours."

Timid types- these are the exact opposite of the former. They are very tentative at the table, very shy, and humble. They hate to draw attention to themselves and have no need to prove themselves. They are afraid to lose large amounts of money, but content to play long hours with little deviation. They are constantly fearing monsters lurking under the bet, the hallmark of this kind of player is when he holds AAA66 and stops raising on the river because he fears his opponent has 6666. They constantly are checking and when they do bet or call they are very hesitant. This uncertainty causes them to call more liberally sometimes. Their most comfortable position tends to be check and call. Some of them may be good players and may use their natural timidness to their advantage. It can be difficult when value betting or raising these players, because their uncertainty can trick you into automatically value betting or raising your good and great hands, only to find they have an even better hands. Also, you may find yourself letting them off the hook alot when you have the best hand because you recognize they may have a better hand than their tentativeness is seeming to indicate. Mostly, though, they are easy to play against because you can get free cards and bet in early position without fearing a raise or a check-raise. Never try to check-raise bluff these players. If they actually found something that is worth betting to them, they will never fold that hand because you raised. Their credo is, "I have to call."

[JJNJustin]

Misanthropes- these are people who have a genuine dislike of society and genuine hatred for people. They are usually loners, but sometimes they hang out in groups of misanthropes. They are extremely self-centered and very lacking in sympathy, empathy, kindness, respect, etc. They have found poker as an acceptable social behavior that they disguise their bad intentions. They tend to play in such a way as to anger their opponents or basically to "stick it to" their opponents. They like to outdraw good hands with garbage, bluff tight players, trap people, slow-play, attack weakness, constantly check-raising. If a check raise is possible, they will almost always go for it, willing to risk losing a bet for the opportunity to piss someone off. They are not playing poker for money rather the satisfaction and enjoyment out of angering their opponents. They have a genuine dislike for everyone at the table and deep down inside their sentiment is "f--- you all." They disdain people who speak of gambling in thereotical, systematic, and mathematical terms. They are quick to get in fights at the table. Some of them are ticking time bombs. They frequently get thrown out of the casino. The are distrustful of other players playing in collusion. They are distrustful of dealers. Some of them are extreme racists. They often throw their cards in violently towards the dealer. They frequently take prescription drugs such as vicadin. Many are alcoholics and alcoholic either intensifies or eases their temperment. Some are bipolar and have violent outbursts. Some may be involved in organized crime such as mafia, biker gangs, meth labs, etc. They often threaten their opponents to a fight in the parking garage and some develope elaborate revenge scenarios centering around violence. Some of them are constantly trying to borrow money that they never intend to pay back. They swear and cuss at the table frequently. They get genuine satisfaction out of other people losing and care very little whether they win or not. In fact, many of them are willing to lose or take marginal or big losses if it will fuel their need to anger other players and make them tilt. Some of them have an excess of funds due to involvement in organized crime and no family attachements or expenses (except on drugs, booze, and whores). Some of them play poker mainly to kill time and use some of their excess funds to thwart other players attempts to make money. Their credo is, "You suck."

Sensitive types- these are in fact, opposites of the misanthropes. These people are emotionally sensitive and are have a high desire for social approval and reward. They are typically do-gooders and sometimes have trouble playing hands against people they like because they dont want to appear greedy or rude. In a close-decision between a check-raise or a bet, they will almost always bet, because they dont want to anger another player or lose that player's friendship. Many times they miss value bets because they are heads-up against someone they like. They are extremely sensitive to other players' emotional cues, and being well-liked is very important to them. They tend to fold more hands when someone they consider a friend raises to avoid the possibility of beating that person. They are very polite at the table and it takes alot to anger them. They are very complaisent and willing to take a small loss or inconvenience to avoid conflict. They are non-confrontational and because of that they avoid playing heads-up pots and strive to play multi-way pots where their value betting is like likely to be construed as "personal". Many of them show their cards frequently if they are not called in order to maintain their opponents favor. They are unlikely to bluff, especially against someone who likes them. Some of them are more interested in making conversation with the other players then with playing the game. The social aspect of the game is important to them and some of them even play solely for the opportunity to socialize. Although this personality trait may seem detrimental to their profitability, there is one advantage it affords them. Because they are emotionally sensitive, they are often adept hand readers and have good poker instinct. They often pick up "tells" or even vague "feelings" that lead them to make the right decisions more often. In fact, this skill or ability is what often keeps these players alive in the game and allows them to overcome their other shortcomings, especially if they learn to manage or overcome them. Their credo is, "Lets play and have a good time doing it."

[JJNJustin]

Part II, how to play against players who strongly exhibit these characteristics:

1) Rigid players: These players tend be very strong mathematically but weaker instinctively and psychologically. Put them to tough decisions that makes them rely on their instinct and psychology. Take advantage of their stubbornness. Try to play heads up pots with them, especially in position. But most importantly, play in such a way that confuses them and messes with their mind. They are very logical thinkers and are quick to pigeonwhole their opponents for future reference. Say early on in a session you call a rigid player on the river with a hand that cant possibly win a show down, say 7 high. A hand that you should either bet or raise bluff or fold, but not call. Once a rigid player sees you do this he will make the conclusion that you are a reckless unknowledgable player and he will rigidly hold this conclusion about you long enough for you to get good dividends on this play. Secondly, a rigid player relies on certainty and routine. When he is convinced he has the best hand, he plunges forward and bets or raises, when he is convinced he doesnt, he folds. You want to keep him in the cusp, in the uncertain area, where he is very uncertain and consequently just calls. You want to make plays that constantly keep him off balance. You want to break up his routine all the while screwing with his head. In general, when in position, you want to do alot of semi-bluff raising when he bets and lot of checking on the next round when he checks. An each of the four rounds of the hand you want to give him a different impression of the strength of your hand. An example would be 3-betting before the flop, checking behind him on the flop, then raising him on the turn when he bets into you, then checking it down on the river. You want to constantly keep him off balance, misrepresenting the strength of your hand. If you do play a hand against a rigid player, whether beaten or not, dont fall into the "just call" mode. Dont constantly go to war with rigid players, either, as they tend to play top hands pre-flop and post-flop. Dont constantly 3-bet them with middle pairs or AQ or JJ or you will get into trouble. But once in a while is definately ok. Play heads up pots with them. Play in position. Make seemingly goofy and irrational plays to mess with their logic. The most important thing is you mix up your game (starting cards, betting patterns) enough to confuse them and render them helpless against you. However, dont resort to all-out bluffing. Rigid players, by definition are stubborn and usually wont lay a good hand down, especially heads-up.
Dont try to tilt them, either, as they have high tilt tolerance, and when they sense they are in tilt, they usually get up and leave.

[surfinillini]

dude...did you copy/paste this article directly from pokerplayer newspaper this month...

are you trying to pass this off as original?

lame...

[BarronVangorToth]

That whole article works better as a Breakfast Club analogy.

[JJNJustin]

yes I am trying to claim this ideas as original mostly because I know I can habitually expect much acclaim and praise from other users of 2+2.

These ideas are obviously not original, but I was reading some books on psychology and found this one interesting hypothesis that claimed that the three major neurohormones in the brain could be linked to certain emotional tendancies and personality traits, which included the ones I wrote about. I couldnt help but notice that these traits in particular affect poker players and their playing styles in obvious ways. Surely any of you who play regularly will be familiar with my descriptions, and probably know a few people who fit into each one of the descriptions strongly.

I dont know about the article in pokerplayernewspaper you are talking about, but I pulled up their website and couldnt find anything like that.

I think its good that everytime someone makes a post on this website people who have nothing to add reply with sarcastic one liners and snide remarks. It makes for good discussion. I think it's pretty much the hallmark of this site. Let me guess, dude, I suck at poker and at life.
Oh wait, someone quote that and say yep.

-J

[JJNJustin]

I am going conclude my input on this thread by asking, how would you, even if you dont like this thread or me, play against the 6 extreme stereotypes as I have described? What are some strategies to employ and things to avoid? This includes limit and no-limit games. I think playing optimally against different opponent types is an important concept.

-J

[surfinillini]

[ QUOTE ]
I think its good that everytime someone makes a post on this website people who have nothing to add reply with sarcastic one liners and snide remarks. It makes for good discussion. I think it's pretty much the hallmark of this site.

[/ QUOTE ]

I just asked a question...I'll find the article and send it to you via PM...it's identical to what you posted, that's all...

[RiverDood]

I'll try to give you a more engaged answer -- but maybe even this isn't totally what you're looking for.

The first distinction, Rigid/Impulsive, is interesting and maps pretty closely to tight-aggressive vs. loose-aggressive. Your peripheral character traits pretty much match up to what I've seen over the years. (Some of them, in fact, are quite nicely done!) There is a LOT of literature out there about how to play against disciplined TAG players vs. free-wheeling LAG players. No big quarrels with what you say -- but it's already out there.

Your last two splits don't make sense to me. I've played poker intermittently since the 1970s at all kinds of levels, from giggly teens with quarters to WSOP contenders playing for scary amounts of money. I've never met a regular player who met your "timid" profile. People with personalities like that try the game twice, don't enjoy it, and go back to needlepoint. There are lots of people who play inconsistently -- jamming some pots too hard and running away from others that are winnable. But that's a whole different mental makeup.

And I've seen more blue unicorns than what you describe as "sensitive" players. Yes, there are jerks vs. good-natured people at the table -- and the good-natured ones will be happy to chat sports, ask you about your favorite movies, etc. They may even soft-play a little against a short-stack who's about to bust out, just so they aren't seen as the final bully in someone else's awful night. But when serious pots are at stake, even the friendly folks play to win.