Dissatisfied with # of 3rd place finishes.

[TheFishhh]

Starting last Thursday, the 21st, I began playing in the $250 PM SnGs on Full Tilt. My first 5-game session went well, as I cashed in 4 of them. Although I was satisfied with the 80% win rate, I was dissatisfied with the number of 3rd place finishes making up 75% of my total finishes. Re-evaluating my 3rd place wins, I found that I am either severely short-stacked after bubble play & I am blinded out or that my TAG style begins to slip & I find myself playing weak-tight. now, realizing I hadn't read up on my SnG strategy articles, I skimmed a few that I was linked to through SnGWIZ & found that my TAG style is fine up until the 4 or 5th level, when blinds are 50/100 or 60/120. At this point, I read that I should be limping in with mid- to late-position with mid-pairs & mid- to high-suited connectors (basically, 77+, 89s+). Unable to stay away from the tables for any significant amount of time, I strayed away from the articles & began another 5-game session. Only this time, I cashed in only 2 of them. A 2nd place finish, & again, a 3rd. Later, I played in 6 more SnGs, cashing in 4, bringing my day's results to 10 cashes in 16 sngs, a ~67% win rate & a $1,400 profit. This would've been all fine & dandy if my 3rd place finishes didn't make up 70% of my day's total finishes. I just couldn't handle all my 3rd place finishes - they made me feel like I played nittish & was lucky to even make it in the money. So again, I skimmed through some more articles & tried to commit to memory what it was I was reading.

Next day, I cash in a monumental 3 out of 10 sngs. The negative profit I made up for grinding out the 5/10 NLHE tables, regardless, I was beginning to grow frustrated, but I realized variance was partially to blame. Anyways, instead of playing in more sngs, I took the day off to actually read the SnG articles SnGWIZ was linking me too. I attempted to act as a sponge & soak up all that was being talked about - early stage strategy, middle stage strategy, late stage strategy, & all that entails. After reading a few articles, I called it a day.

Yesterday, what I read apparently begun to sink in. Cashing in only 5 of 10 SnGs. This would've further dampened my spirits if 4 of the 5 cashes hadn't been 1st place finishes. The other finish was a 3rd, but the 1st place finishes said to me, 'It's beginning to sink in. You're beginning to realize the important of what you've been reading. Don't stop now, keep reading & keep applying what you're reading to the sngs you play in.' Now today, I've played a total of 17 sngs. Cashing in 11 of them, with three 1st place finishes, four 2nd place finishes & four 3rd place finishes. My goal for today was for my 1st & 2nd place finishes to make up the majority of my total cashes, & I have accomplished that thus far (I intend on playing in 4 more sngs before the day's end). Still yet, I just do not know what to do with all my 3rd place finishes. I've tried loosening up once the 4th or 5th levels come around, if I am short-stacked, I push with premium hands. If this gets me past the bubble, I then begin to attempt to steal blinds (when it's checked to me on a flop holding all low cards, I bet 3 to 4xBB) & the majority of the time, I am able to do so. But, what I often find is that I'm pushing (if I'm short-stacked) at all the wrong times. I realize I should probably be doing this only when i have position, but OOP, I feel that my pushes are accomplishing little, if anything at all. Nevertheless, what I would like to do is the following:

• Have my 1st & 2nd place finishes make up the majority of my cashes, rather than the minority.
• Be able to get past bubble play with a medium- to large-stack, rather than a severely limited short-stack.
• Become a consistent winner in sngs & eventually build my bankroll up to $40,000 to $70,000 so that I am able to play in the $2,000 sngs.

Now, I saw that many SnG players use ROI to gage whether or not they are doing well, so I decided I'd see what mine was just for kicks - because with such a small sample (52 games), I understand not much is being represented. Regardless, in 52 games, I've spent a total of $15,000 (Icommitted a sin & played in a game that my bankroll doesn't support - a $2,000 SnG in which I placed 3rd for $3,100) & I've made a total of $13,930. So if I read the RIO definition correctly & how to figure it out, it's 100 * total profit/total buy-in, thus 100 * 13930/15000 = 92.8 or ~93%. Meaning I have a 93% ROI, which I understand is pretty significant, as I've read that professional SnG players have between 30 - 100% ROI. I can only hope my ROI stays withint 20% of what it is now as my sample size increases. Regardless, I would appreciated any advice that could help me improve my SnG game. Especially how to lessen my 3rd place finishes & maxmimize my 1st & 2nd place finishes. Thanks in advance.

[BadBeatsCrewDerk]

Is this a joke?

[TheFishhh]

.. no. Why would it be a joke?

[DevinLake]

People might think it's a joke because if its not, you are very dilusional.

Getting in the money 40% of the time would be very good. Have an ROI of 5% would be decent.

You are running insanely hot. I'd cash out your profit and go grind like the $27s until you A) learn how to play sngs and B) learn what realistic goals and results are.

You sample is too small to mean anything and I doubt you are an actual winner in the game.

[Kevin8423]

[ QUOTE ]
& was lucky to even make it in the money.

[/ QUOTE ]

Bingo.

When reality kicks in you will be very unhappy, I suggest quitting while you are ahead.

Edit: BTW just so you know it is extremely difficult to have a 20%+ ROI in the $16s, less in the $27s and much higher than that a one digit ROI is all that is usually achievable by even the best pros that play the game. It is IMPOSSIBLE to have anywhere near a 92% ROI in any game any stake if it is a single table tournament.

Lol disregard all I have said. Skipped over "PM".

[TheFishhh]

Oh, I see why people might think this is a joke. Apparently PM isn't recognizable as meaning play money. I apologize. Regardless, it seems that you're (DevinLake) incredibly critical toward my post. I'm still learning the game (I'm 15 & have only been playing for a few months) & if what I've said seems unrealistic, dilusional, what have you, I apologize. Instead of being partially negative, could you try & be a tad bit more positive - explain to me what realistic goals & results are & give me tips, links, etc. pertaining to SnG play.

Again, I apologize for the confusion.

[BradleyT]

[ QUOTE ]
Although I was satisfied with the 80% win rate

[/ QUOTE ]

I thought about stopping here but figured there might be some comedic value in this post. I was not disappointed.

Good luck with your 93% ROI!

[BradleyT]

Wait..........you're playing play money SnGs????

[STALLOWN3D]

[ QUOTE ]
Oh, I see why people might think this is a joke. Apparently PM isn't recognizable as meaning play money. I apologize. Regardless, it seems that you're (DevinLake) incredibly critical toward my post. I'm still learning the game (I'm 15 & have only been playing for a few months) & if what I've said seems unrealistic, dilusional, what have you, I apologize. Instead of being partially negative, could you try & be a tad bit more positive - explain to me what realistic goals & results are & give me tips, links, etc. pertaining to SnG play.

Again, I apologize for the confusion.

[/ QUOTE ]

You can find a lot of stuff in the FAQ at the top of the STTF page. There really is no way to tell you anything if you've only played play money games.

[TheFishhh]

Yes. Like I said, I'm just learning the game, 15-years-old & looking for some help..