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#81
10-12-2007, 03:48 PM
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Re: The Myth of Meaning
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If God does not exist, our universe lacks that meaning. [/ QUOTE ] We exist, and we can give it meaning. It really doesn't have to be more advanced than that. 
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#82
10-12-2007, 03:55 PM
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Re: The Myth of Meaning
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Look when someone believes something is true it is true for them until they are shown otherwise.. [/ QUOTE ] Perhaps we are arguing apples and oranges. You are not differentiating between "it is true for them" and "reality." The word for what your describing is "delusion." [ QUOTE ] A delusion is an unshakable belief in something untrue. [/ QUOTE ] Let's take a specific God.... Zeus. In reality, he either exists or he does not. Whether or not you believe in him has no bearing on the truth of the matter. All you're saying is 'people believe what they believe'... fine. We both agree. What is NOT right is WHAT PEOPLE BELIEVE=REALITY. [ QUOTE ] The answer to this is that "we do not question God's wisdom or reason for doing things" Perhaps God did protect the Christian by making him not suffer or bringing him to heaven after his death. There might be many expalnations for the death not countering the belief that the christian was being protected. [/ QUOTE ] But you're contradicting yourself. You are asserting that if someone believes in something then it is real. If believing something made it real, then simply believing the lion would not hurt him would have to mean the lion would not hurt him. He was delusional. His beliefs did not reflect reality. I believe you're playing semantics trying to salvage the lion story when, clearly the man thought the lion wasn't going to kill him.
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#83
10-12-2007, 04:19 PM
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Re: The Myth of Meaning
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I haven't read the whole thread, but I think this is easily answerable by looking at the definition of meaning: From dictionary.com 1. to have in mind as one's purpose or intention; intend: I meant to compliment you on your work. 2. to intend for a particular purpose, destination, etc.: They were meant for each other. If God exists, this generally implies an intelligent creator of our universe. In other words, our universe was made to be the way it is because God intended it to be that way.Thus, there is "purpose" or "intention" behind our universe (definition (1) of meaning). If God does not exist, our universe lacks that meaning. I agree that God's existence does not necessarily add any "personal" or "subjective" meaning to our lives, but I think when most theists claim that God gives their lives meaning they are referring to it in a more "universal" or "absolute" since... i.e. the universe as a whole has meaning. [/ QUOTE ] I'm glad you made this post. I don't think any logical discussion can take place on this issue without strictly defining meaning. I think you're right when you use the dictionary definition you just posted. However, I think what luckyme is trying to understand is the claim that without God our lives are meaningless. To me that implies a different definition of meaning, but that's just my personal view on the word and is likely different from many others. Regarding the definition of meaning in your post, does a lack of intelligently designed purpose mean that there can be no "absolute" or "universal" meaning?
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#84
10-12-2007, 04:22 PM
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Re: The Myth of Meaning
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[ QUOTE ] If God does not exist, our universe lacks that meaning. [/ QUOTE ] We exist, and we can give it meaning. It really doesn't have to be more advanced than that. [/ QUOTE ] According to the definition he provided, it does need to be more advanced than that. We can't give the universe meaning in the way he defined it. Like I said in my other post, the ambiguity of the definition of meaning is causing a lot of problems in this thread.
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#85
10-12-2007, 04:33 PM
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Re: The Myth of Meaning
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[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] If God does not exist, our universe lacks that meaning. [/ QUOTE ] We exist, and we can give it meaning. It really doesn't have to be more advanced than that. [/ QUOTE ] According to the definition he provided, it does need to be more advanced than that. We can't give the universe meaning in the way he defined it. Like I said in my other post, the ambiguity of the definition of meaning is causing a lot of problems in this thread. [/ QUOTE ] Well, if his definition of meaning is that it means the universe has to have an absolute and objective masterplan then this discussion is basically pointless. It would kinda be like me defining the universe as 'everything when not created by god'.
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#86
10-12-2007, 06:25 PM
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Re: The Myth of Meaning
gods love for me would add meaning to my life if god was a totally hot chick
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#87
10-13-2007, 06:21 AM
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Re: The Myth of Meaning
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Well, if his definition of meaning is that it means the universe has to have an absolute and objective masterplan then this discussion is basically pointless. [/ QUOTE ] Yes that was my point. However we can't knock his definition because he pulled it from dictionary.com, so it's not like he made it up.
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