Sooo

[Kirkrrr]

I think we have to look at this hand from the OP's point of view, ie no reads on the MP being horrible or showing up with 34o since he didn't know that at the time, so that is irrelevant.

Far as the hand, MP limped and then cold-called a 3-bet which will be a middle pair the majority of the time... rbk is possibly right, but then again 88 seems a lot more likely here than some kind of a draw, as very few "combo-draw" hands will survive pre-flop there under normal circumstances... or he just outplayed the [censored] out of both of you.

In any case, I think folding is ok there, but getting it in could be ok too, though by no means [censored] automatic. I prefer a fold since you really have to be a huge optimist to imagine that you are usually still ahead there (you obviously will be sometimes, but often enough to make it an insta-call like everyone is saying? - doubt it), and even if you are, MP should still have a third of the deck working to bail him out (which is your best-case scenario).

Kirk

[riverboatking]

haha kirk you crazy bastard.
like you've ever folded a set in your life.
don't you let me down mofo.

[Kirkrrr]

[ QUOTE ]
haha kirk you crazy bastard.
like you've ever folded a set in your life.
don't you let me down mofo.

[/ QUOTE ]

While I can't recall a specific instance, something in the very depths of my memory is stirring, so I think it actually might have happened! ...plus, jcmoussa is a better player so just b/c i'm not good enough to do it doesn't mean he shouldn't be [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Kirk

[jlocdog]

[ QUOTE ]
basic rule of thumb:

always go broke in a raised pot.

edit: in spots like this i think the original raiser checks the turn a huge % of the time after getting called in 2 spots on this flop. therefore a good player won't go for a CR on the turn especally as it will often shut you out in the middle.
most good players with a set will just call the flop maybe in the hopes that you make a move behind, however when you just call the flop i think good players lead out on the turn.
this way they make you call a bet in between and get you involved in the pot, because if it goes check, check, check its lame, and if the original raiser actually bets again and they CR its pretty hard to get you to tag along.
the odds of set over set are pretty long, so unless he knows you'll only overcall the flop with a set its kind of a risky move.
not saying people won't play a set like this, i just think good players are more prone to leading the turn given the dynamics of the preflop and flop action.
i don't know who the original raiser is and that may be a factor if he's the type to just bomb every street regardless, but if he's not retarded he's checking the turn in this spot with AA like 99.99999% of the time.

[/ QUOTE ]

Damn yo.... another ridiculous post. Profound on many levels.

[Micturition Man]

I'm surprised nobody commented on the bet sizes.

MP3 made weird underbets on every street, which I think makes it a lot easier psychologically for villain to be making a balls-out bluff on the turn.

If all bets/raises had been standard in this hand, and without any reads, it would look very much like a set.

With the info that villain is crazy and with MP3 making his weird scared looking bets, despite the deep stacks, I am a lot more comfortable pushing here I think... though obv it's not remotely suprising if it's set-over-set.

IMO.