So I'm getting screwed by a bookie. Ideas?

[Daliman]

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factor debt to people who will collect as I suggested before, LDO.

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I'm not doing that, period. I have a family. But other investors are not quite as interested in being diplomatic.

[Daliman]

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It's tlt's gimmick account. He's so unoriginal that he couldn't even use capitalization or quit writing in a signature at the end of every post.

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tlt?

[Witzo]

Threaten to ruin his legit careers. Slander and Libel are only those things if they're lies. I'm sure you can rent a Billboard for a few days or even tip off the local news and get them a scoop. Of course these are all last straws as you're definitely not getting paid then :-/

Also if he's paying through poker sites you can threaten to report him to the poker site he's using. (At least FTP would since they love to randomly ban people and freeze assets)

[kdog]

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factor debt to people who will collect as I suggested before, LDO.

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This would get you some of your money but nowhere near what you are owed and you have to consider the possibility of him factoring your head for doing it. Plus it's usually best to stay away from the type of fine upstanding citizens who buy this type of debt.

Realistically your options are pretty limited. You're not the type that's able to physically intimidate him into paying(IF he even has the money to pay) so unless you want to get quite involved with the police.... Because dropping one dime on him ain't gonna do [censored]. The cops are going to want a lot more info than that before they go after him. Like enough to get warrants and things like that. Which opens up the possibility of your name being mentioned as an informant. No good can come of that.

[Daliman]

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factor debt to people who will collect as I suggested before, LDO.

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This would get you some of your money but nowhere near what you are owed and you have to consider the possibility of him factoring your head for doing it. Plus it's usually best to stay away from the type of fine upstanding citizens who buy this type of debt.

Realistically your options are pretty limited. You're not the type that's able to physically intimidate him into paying(IF he even has the money to pay) so unless you want to get quite involved with the police.... Because dropping one dime on him ain't gonna do [censored]. The cops are going to want a lot more info than that before they go after him. Like enough to get warrants and things like that. Which opens up the possibility of your name being mentioned as an informant. No good can come of that.

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NO WAI! I am 162 pounds of rippling muscle!

FWIW, he was busted ~18 months ago, so he may be much more reticent to get busted again than usual. Not quite as cncerned about being named "an informent" as it will be pretty obvious I will do most anything legal to get my $$$/make his life harder.

[Lacan212]

Hypothetically, these could be two potentials actions:

1. His image
I have never used a "bookie", but I would imagine that they run on some sort of creditability. A "bookie" is selling a product, if his product is bad, people won't buy it. If people know if that he is an individual that does not pay, then he should not get any customers. Again, due to the nature of his business, I am not really sure how one could possibly inform other customers.

2. Tell the authorities
The obvious problem with this solution is that the consumer will not get his/her money back (RICO = asset forfeiture, similar to drug trafficking cases) and he/she could possibly face legal action. In fact, I would think that the only reason someone would resort to this is a nuclear option. One could possibly tell the authorities that they have knowledge of a "big time bookie", but that they would not testify without immunity (In theory, they could not compel him/her to testify due to 5th amendment right against self-incrimination, if they force him/her to testify, then they would have to grant him/her immunity from prosecution).


Option 1 appears to the only course of action that could result in the individual getting some of their money. Option 2 is only for revenge/justice. Illegal transactions are out of the bounds of legitimacy (/Ontology), so obviously there are no legal tools to assist consumers with this. Option 1 could seen as consumers attempting to reason with "the bookie" that he needs to run a more sound business or else he will lose customers. Option 2 is more of a "game of brinkmanship."

Also, isn't is possible for bookies to run bad if they are not taking even sided action? Legitimate books can take short-time hits, I doubt a more small time bookie could. What if he simply doesn't have the money or is possibly just running a scam?

Sorry for your situation and GL.


Option 3: "Surprise Witnesses. Each one more surprising than the last. I tell you, the judge won't know what hit him."

[dankhank]

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factor debt to people who will collect as I suggested before, LDO.

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I'm not doing that, period. I have a family. But other investors are not quite as interested in being diplomatic.

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if you aren't willing/able to use illegal tactics (like stealing his car) to persuade a bookie to pay you, then you should have never wagered that kind of money with him in the first place.

also - for people who might learn from this sucky situation - when you are getting the almost-too-good-to-be-true numbers on even money teasers that you got from this guy, you should not share him with anybody. you directly cut into your own profits when you let others in on such a lucrative opportunity.

[Performify]

And to add to what Dank said, one more guidelines for the future / those listening

Never, ever, ever, let a local get behind.

This never should have gotten to 80k.

Settle every week with your local. Make a big point of it. Both directions. You pay promptly, and you expect he pays promptly.

The best locals that I *ahem* know collect once a week like clockwork once you're established, and they pay out once a week like clockwork a couple days after the collection. And the first time that payout is even a couple hours late, you need to start to make other plans.

If he slides one week and hasn't corrected the next, then you're working on a much smaller debt and he can recover. Never let a guy get in to you for more than one or two weeks maximum, just like you should never get in to a guy like this for more than one or two weeks maximum.

-P

[Performify]

Dali,

My unofficial advice:

Get in touch with the guy directly. Do whatever it takes to make this happen. Be creative.

Do whatever it takes -- call from a payphone; have an intermediary make a bet that you plan to lose, schedule a meet to pay, and interrupt the meet; show up at his place of reputable business, whatever you can do.

When you do, bring a friend, the kind of friend you'd like to do this sort of thing with. Do not show up alone.

Calmly but clearly explain that you'd like to receive your money, and that you're more than happy to work out a payment plan.

Do not try to get cute and roll him for vig.

Propose he can drop you 20k a week for the next four weeks, for example, and you'll be more than happy.

Collect the first payment, or at least a down payment on the first payment, right there.

-P

[kemystery]

this is the risk you accept dealing with a bookie, from someone who was involved with those types of operations it looks to me like your bookie is broke, I'd def try to work out a payment plan, and I'd consider myself lucky to get any payments

the threat of you going to the police is pretty unrealistic to him, he knows that would be akin to calling the police to report your drug dealer for shorting your sack

in the future I would advise against laying 80K worth of action with a street bookie obv, but if you plan on cornering this guy the best place is prob at his biz/work that will have the most impact phone calls and messages is not the way you're going to nail down some payment plan w/ this guy

GL