let draws see turn cheap for better fold equity?

MrRoboto313 · #1 10-10-2007, 01:20 PM

ok this is jsut an idea. but i play in a 1/2 game at a local card room. and its the biggest game in town. $100 min/max buy in. a lot of people call all ins with flush draws on the flop bcause of the min/max buy in is $100. so they wanna double up and play or go broke and buy back in.

example

hero= K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 10[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
villain= Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

flop K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 10[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
he will call a large bet here. but then he has pot odds to call all in on turn

turn 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
now with a big bet here he would fold and i take the small pot i built up.
now would it be a good idea for instance to lead out small on the flop and let them see a cheap turn so they would be more likely to fold on the turn with a big bet because there percentage to hit gets cut in half?

i know in general you would want him to call an all in here because 60% of the time ill take it. but i mean 40% the flush will hit and i go broke and double the guy up. now im tilting a bit and could lose more .

just a theory to stop getting sucked out on

greggg230 · #2 10-10-2007, 01:26 PM

sounds like it's more a matter of bankroll and tilt control

you want to get it in on the flop

MrRoboto313 · #3 10-10-2007, 01:27 PM

it has a lot to do with bankroll. its an easy game but most of the players are local business owners with loads of cash to blow. im a college student supplmenting some income.

greggg230 · #4 10-10-2007, 01:45 PM

[ QUOTE ]
it has a lot to do with bankroll. its an easy game but most of the players are local business owners with loads of cash to blow. im a college student supplmenting some income.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you don't have the bankroll for 1/2 NL, then I'd probably suggest playing online at lower stakes where you don't have to avoid +EV situations like this.

Are you folding KK to pushes pre-flop? Even against a pretty loose range, you're only a 65% favorite

Paxinor · #5 10-10-2007, 01:52 PM

you shouldn't be playing in this game if you cannot afford to play risk neutral since you will give up all the edges you have and you'd be a losing player.

MrRoboto313 · #6 10-10-2007, 01:56 PM

my bankroll ist good for 1/2 i think. its about 800. with a back up of around 400. the problem is more in the value of tilt control i guess. when im 65% to win getting like even money + blinds ill call everytime. the problem is going on tilt because of it is gonna possible cost me more in the long run.

i guess the right move is to push. and if i get felted take a break and come back later to get it back.

greggg230 · #7 10-10-2007, 02:09 PM

[ QUOTE ]
my bankroll ist good for 1/2 i think. its about 800. with a back up of around 400. the problem is more in the value of tilt control i guess. when im 65% to win getting like even money + blinds ill call everytime. the problem is going on tilt because of it is gonna possible cost me more in the long run.

i guess the right move is to push. and if i get felted take a break and come back later to get it back.

[/ QUOTE ]

It depends on your winrate. With a good winrate, having 6 buy-ins is probably a little risky, but not crazy. OTOH, if you don't have that big of a winrate, you might need substantially more than that.

MrRoboto313 · #8 10-10-2007, 02:45 PM

i have a good winrate there. in my last 10 buy-ins ive felted twice. its not so much that id want to not get it in with this hand. i was just wondering if it would be better to push with my 65% edge or to take it down everytime with less risk of suckout. but looking back it seems like i would be giving up the very edge im there to play. so thanks for your help

PantsOnFire · #9 10-10-2007, 04:15 PM

I read this post twice and the responses once, and I really don't know how to respond. Maybe you could take this to the Psychology Forum.

mce86 · #10 10-10-2007, 10:55 PM

I like the philosophy and do use it live quite often. I still charge em on the flop, but im looking for the turn to bring out the big guns. Now, when they call A LARGE TURN BET, THEY ARE MAKING A VERY BIG MISTAKE. Also, flop bets often go multiway...weakening tptk type hands.