QQ from upfront early in Warmup...Is this ok?

[g-p]

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Please allow me to explain.

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NO.

NO ONE HERE WANTS TO LISTEN TO YOU.

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whats your problem?

i would call the reraise, you DO have set odds, and you might already be good

[g-p]

also i should add, i disagree with balto but hes not like some huge donkey posting really stupid stuff; he is trying more than most so he doesnt deserve all the hate

[gobboboy]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
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Please allow me to explain.

[/ QUOTE ]

NO.

NO ONE HERE WANTS TO LISTEN TO YOU.

[/ QUOTE ]
whats your problem?

i would call the reraise, you DO have set odds, and you might already be good

[/ QUOTE ]

Because baltostar trolls good players and is a smarmy [censored] and I hate smarmy [censored].

Also, saying you're playing for set value but also saying we might have the best hand makes no sense. Do you think he stacks off you if you flop a set 100% of the time but at the same time checks it down if you have the best hand? That makes no sense.

[Exitonly]

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In the 2nd scenario, the correct implied odds calculation is 1105/120 = 9.2:1 and so you fold (albeit the re-raiser probably brought the necessary odds down to around 13:1).

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You should have accounted for the chance that Button or Blinds would raise when you called the first bet of 60. If you thought it was going to be raised too often to cut down your implied odds, then you fold the first time.

[uphigh_downlow]

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In the 2nd scenario, the correct implied odds calculation is 1105/120 = 9.2:1 and so you fold (albeit the re-raiser probably brought the necessary odds down to around 13:1).

[/ QUOTE ]

You should have accounted for the chance that Button or Blinds would raise when you called the first bet of 60. If you thought it was going to be raised too often to cut down your implied odds, then you fold the first time.

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Thats what makes his post interesting. The vulnerability to a reraise isnt something which is easily quantifiable in terms of pot odds og lost/gained EV.

So basically if you go by his reasoning, when you get to the next decision point, and you realise you messed up in the first place, you fold.

Almost like coding a bot. Take the solution, which is not maximal by any means, but one that could work reasonably in quite a few situations.

That is if he intended it that way, and does not believe the math is accurate as he painted it.

Definitely food for thought.

[registrar]

I really don't like this. The table's second biggest stack opens 3x from MP1, table's biggest stack pops it to 9bbs from OTB, folds to MP1 who has 83BBs behind.

MP1 can play for set value. MP1 can easily have the best hand. Seems like an easy call.

Sure, being OOP sucks on the flop but I don't think that this situation is marginally +EV or anything. It's a clear edge.

[JammyDodga]

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MP1 can play for set value. MP1 can easily have the best hand. Seems like an easy call.


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As someone said earlier, I'm not sure we can have it both ways. We either need to think we are good pre a large part of the time say 50% or more, and play accordingly, or play for set value.

If we aren't good pre-flop, our implied odds on the set go way down. If we aren't good pre-flop, but play in a way which tries to get value from the hand as if we were, then we have some serious negative implied odds issues.

Reg, what are you planning on doing on a 10 high flop?

[JammyDodga]

Hi Baltostar.

Its the nature of interweb message boards that everybody gets flamed and abused sometimes, so you don't always have to take it seriously.

However, sometimes its worth taking a bit of a step back and looking at yourself and your posts and asking if there's anything going on here.

I've been flamed before here, and sometimes it was well deserved. I had posted something dumb, and then tried to back it up so I didn't look stupid. Othertimes, I had a think about what I'd written, and decieded that it was OK.

Here, you know that.

1. Most of your posts get flamed pretty badly.
2. Not many, if any. other posters get treated in the same way.
3. You are getting abused by people who have won a lot of tournaments, and also generally are pretty reasonable with other posters, writing good arguments when they disagree with others.
4. The HSMTT board is different to alot of the others, people seem to actually klnow what they are talking about.


You are obviously a smart guy, so you must have thought about this. What have you concluded is the reason for all of this? Do you honestly believe that you are 100% right and everyone else is wrong?

I really think you need to at least consider your position, the inability to see when you might be wrong can be pretty dangerous.

Finally I think you seem to think too much about your own arguments. These are often well constructed and well thought out. But sometimes you seem to get yourself into a way about thinking about things which is wrong, and leads to incorrect conclusions. Often people here will try and argue with you, but they are coming at it from a different angle. because this doesn't fit in with you you are thinking, you seem to dismiss it out of hand, and carry on repeatin your own argument.

I seriously suggest you try considering other peoples arguments afresh, and seeing if there's anything in them. If you cant reconcile the two views, think about why not.

People really apreciate it if you respond to their arguments, rather than just repeating and expanding on your own views. Even if you are right, this is not the best way to win arguments and convince people.

[registrar]

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Reg, what are you planning on doing on a 10 high flop?

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Folding on the turn a lot of the time.

[JammyDodga]

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Reg, what are you planning on doing on a 10 high flop?

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Folding on the turn a lot of the time.

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So you think you can play post flop profitably, if you dont hit your set?