Stars VIP Wild speculation

[MicroBob]

FWIW - I'm not sure that total-hands per hour per player was a huge consideration in the 12-table max. I think there were other reasons why they have this but I'm not really sure.

I have virtually no feelings at all about the 12-table deal and really don't care if they switch to 10-and-15 or not. If they do...fine. If they don't...fine. If they switch to 8-table max for everyone including SNG's or switch to 30-tables max for cash-games then that's fine too.
I think it's kind of a dumb thing to be concerned about.

And blaming the difficulty of getting elite on the 12-table max seems a bit silly too.
You know there are more points to be earned at NL200 and NL400. You also know that you can get more points faster at 6-max. You simply pretty much refuse to play those games and then blame Stars and their 12-table max when you see that it's really really hard to get to Elite playing as low as full-ring NL100.

I could argue that if they let me play 40 cash-game tables then I could probably earn 600 points an hour by playing on all NL10 or NL25 tables and that would be enough points to get me to Elite. "You are prejudiced against us NL25 players who really really want to get to elite but have no chance because you don't let us play 40 tables."

It's like complaining that the low-stakes players don't get as much as the higher-stakes players.
Well...no duh.

[Alobar]

good post bob

and like the stars reps have said, its called "elite" for a reason, they only want a very few select people to be able to achieve it. Its not supposed to be for every low limit grinder out there, thats what supernova and the bonuses are for.

[OnlinePro]

I will speak from the fixed limit end of the argument about getting to Supernova Elte bbecause that is the only thing I play

1. Unfair that SNG players get to play unlimited games while cash game players have 12 table limit. Ide rather play more tables and less hours. Doesnt matter about winning or losing because that is all up to stars anyways, so you might as well maximize your tables.

2. Free rolls are stupid and bias. Geared towards no-limit tournament players that have nothing to do on Saturdays. Do you not think this is getting too specific, alianating the rest of the poker population. Might I add that alianating the part of the poker population that you need most is not such a smart idea. There are tons and tons of No limit tournament players ( fish and pros ) out there, but what is the player base for Cash game fixed limit players ?

3. Add more ( special perks ) at all milestone levels.

FE: You get 1.8c per FPP at the 500,000 milestone level or things of that nature. Instead of a onetime 4,200 dollar bonus that you have to play 20,000 hands to clear which is plenty of hands for them to rig against you and spread out that money throughout their player pool.


Solutions

1. Allow no max on games played, if a player can play 40 tables at once than allow him to do so.

2. Absolutely, possitively, get rid of the stupid freerolls. One time monthly bonus will be better , or T money or, even a money maker plate set with matching cups.

3. More lucrative rewards for 2million, 3 million, 4 million and 5 million. To make it worth while for dealing with rigged and borring online poker. I want to know there is a good reward after watching people fold for hours, days and weeks on in.

4. Get rid of Pokertracker and other software aids. If players are not good enough to play on their own then let them suffer. It just might help the games, way way too many tighty tighty nits. Its similar to allowing robots.

5. Advance notice of Double VPP days and more double VPP days. Hey theres a great Idea, get rid of all freerolls including the 100k monthly and all other freerolls and add 1 Double VPP day per month or 2 so that incase someone misses the one day they can have the other. Dont whine about this promo costing you too much money, because players will have to play and pay rake in order to get these points so it will increase play greatly on those days.

6. Start doing things to appeal to more regular ( non pro ) players as mentioned above removing the PA huds and such would help greatly.

7. Bottom line thinking will bottom out your company. Dont merely think of how to get more pros to play more tables against each other. For full ring limit games, if you play 12 tables, there are 8 players who are on most if not all your tables. What goes through the casual players mind when any table he opens he sees the same players on all tables ? He just closes down the software and plays somewhere else. Bring in more fish to games otherwise I see the future of limit poker dying very soon if not already dead. And yes this means the dreaded reload bonuses that stars just loves to hate. Stop being stingy and dishem out. The money is going to circulate back into your pockets anyways.

But then again what do I know, Ive only ran 5 successfull buisness and have net worth over 2 mill. ( which has dropped to 1.90 due to rigged poker on stars.

For those curious I am down about 20k on stars this year without counting any FPP or milestone bonuses. After all things considered Im down only 6k. Which is not bad at all considering I havent played 1 week of poker which hasnt been rigged on me. I have had maybe 5 normal days of poker all year.

Microbob, stop posting play more poker, it would be shame if you dont make elite this year because your posting here way to often. Maybe you dont win at poker because of bad decision making ?Posting over playing always bad decision. Im not sure if you win or not but I remember you saying that your slightly down.

[1p0kerboy]

Bob-

Wasn't sure Stars was following this thread and I didn't know they had staff members that routinely monitored the online poker forums other than Scottyy and the few others that respond occasionally.

Other than that, I think you misunderstand what I am saying here.

I'm not 'blaming' Stars' 12-table max for me not making Elite. If they didn't have a max, I likely wouldn't make it playing smaller stakes. Either way I would most definitely have to play higher.

I think you're a bit indifferent because you play much less tables than I do. But if Stars had a 4-table max (I'm assuming you play 6-8?) you might send them an e-mail saying you would like to play more.

I know I can accumulate points faster at 6-max and I never said I refuse to play those games, so I don't know where your comment came from. In fact, I've been playing quite a bit of 6-max lately.

My e-mail was mainly to point out that if Stars is trying to make sure we are acting quickly (which is why I assume they have the max table rule in the first place) then just capping off the number of tables we can play is probably not their best solution. The reason is that 6-max players are going to have 150% as many actions as full ring players.

This affects much more than a quest for Elite too. It cuts many players' bottom line as well as the rake rake Stars would otherwise get.

Perhaps I shouldn't have tied this in with a possible desire to chase Elite next year.

Either way, I think you're over-reacting a bit to an idea that I had.

[1p0kerboy]

[ QUOTE ]
Its not supposed to be for every low limit grinder out there, thats what supernova and the bonuses are for.


[/ QUOTE ]

I'm pretty sure it's supposed to be for anybody who reaches 1,000,000 VPPs, regardless how they got there.

The lower stakes guys are paying a ton of rake just like the higher stakes guys.

[Alobar]

[ QUOTE ]

The lower stakes guys are paying way less rake than the higher stakes guys.

[/ QUOTE ]

and my point was they dont want to make it easy for low limit grinders to reach elite, because its elite, IE a select few. If low limit grinders could make it, then it would be very easy for TONS of people to make it, and then it wouldnt be elite

[Alobar]

[ QUOTE ]

1. Unfair that SNG players get to play unlimited games while cash game players have 12 table limit. Ide rather play more tables and less hours. Doesnt matter about winning or losing because that is all up to stars anyways, so you might as well maximize your tables.

[/ QUOTE ]

so then start playing SNGs

[Scottyy]

-----Wasn't sure Stars was following this thread

I'm guessing over a dozen people from Stars have read this thread. We debate the issues everytime something interesting is posted.

Major changes, like the max tables for ring, are made slowly. We wouldn't want to make a major change that would then need to be corrected at a later date.

Please keep posting your ideas,

Scotty

[Alobar]

[ QUOTE ]

Please keep posting your ideas,



[/ QUOTE ]

I have a sweet idea for a Poker Stars credit card I posted in another thread [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[bluey]

[ QUOTE ]
I will speak from the fixed limit end of the argument about getting to Supernova Elte bbecause that is the only thing I play

1. Unfair that SNG players get to play unlimited games while cash game players have 12 table limit. Ide rather play more tables and less hours. Doesnt matter about winning or losing because that is all up to stars anyways, so you might as well maximize your tables.

2. Free rolls are stupid and bias. Geared towards no-limit tournament players that have nothing to do on Saturdays. Do you not think this is getting too specific, alianating the rest of the poker population. Might I add that alianating the part of the poker population that you need most is not such a smart idea. There are tons and tons of No limit tournament players ( fish and pros ) out there, but what is the player base for Cash game fixed limit players ?

3. Add more ( special perks ) at all milestone levels.

FE: You get 1.8c per FPP at the 500,000 milestone level or things of that nature. Instead of a onetime 4,200 dollar bonus that you have to play 20,000 hands to clear which is plenty of hands for them to rig against you and spread out that money throughout their player pool.


Solutions

1. Allow no max on games played, if a player can play 40 tables at once than allow him to do so.

2. Absolutely, possitively, get rid of the stupid freerolls. One time monthly bonus will be better , or T money or, even a money maker plate set with matching cups.

3. More lucrative rewards for 2million, 3 million, 4 million and 5 million. To make it worth while for dealing with rigged and borring online poker. I want to know there is a good reward after watching people fold for hours, days and weeks on in.

4. Get rid of Pokertracker and other software aids. If players are not good enough to play on their own then let them suffer. It just might help the games, way way too many tighty tighty nits. Its similar to allowing robots.

5. Advance notice of Double VPP days and more double VPP days. Hey theres a great Idea, get rid of all freerolls including the 100k monthly and all other freerolls and add 1 Double VPP day per month or 2 so that incase someone misses the one day they can have the other. Dont whine about this promo costing you too much money, because players will have to play and pay rake in order to get these points so it will increase play greatly on those days.

6. Start doing things to appeal to more regular ( non pro ) players as mentioned above removing the PA huds and such would help greatly.

7. Bottom line thinking will bottom out your company. Dont merely think of how to get more pros to play more tables against each other. For full ring limit games, if you play 12 tables, there are 8 players who are on most if not all your tables. What goes through the casual players mind when any table he opens he sees the same players on all tables ? He just closes down the software and plays somewhere else. Bring in more fish to games otherwise I see the future of limit poker dying very soon if not already dead. And yes this means the dreaded reload bonuses that stars just loves to hate. Stop being stingy and dishem out. The money is going to circulate back into your pockets anyways.

But then again what do I know, Ive only ran 5 successfull buisness and have net worth over 2 mill. ( which has dropped to 1.90 due to rigged poker on stars.

For those curious I am down about 20k on stars this year without counting any FPP or milestone bonuses. After all things considered Im down only 6k. Which is not bad at all considering I havent played 1 week of poker which hasnt been rigged on me. I have had maybe 5 normal days of poker all year.

Microbob, stop posting play more poker, it would be shame if you dont make elite this year because your posting here way to often. Maybe you dont win at poker because of bad decision making ?Posting over playing always bad decision. Im not sure if you win or not but I remember you saying that your slightly down.

[/ QUOTE ]


scotty pls ignore this entire post. thx