$20/$40 Live red KK on button vs a live one...

Garland · #1 11-12-2006, 08:32 PM

Location: Garden City in San Jose, CA
Stakes: $20/$40 (Drop now $5/hand [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img])
Players: Awesome 9-handed lag game. Extremely aggressive table...of the likes I haven't seen in a long, long while. Some tricky play involved including raising on a pure bluff on a scary turn by a couple of people. Hardly ever limped around as a raise is about 90-95% certain. This table condition actually inspired me to limp re-raise UTG in a limit game with QQ something I haven't done in probably well over a year.

Principal players:

EP - Loose poor player.

MP - Ultra loose aggressive action Asian player. On the youngish side. He has raised all "interesting hands" such as suited connectors and often capped betting with these hands as well. He has also capped betting when he simply cold-called before even declaring "Lucky raise" when he limp 3-bet and I capped with AQo and showed 65o on a 66x board (he chopped with 64s, and I folded on turn bet/raise after not putting another chip in the pot post-flop in 4 ways). Will make moves.

Button - Me. I have not played a hand in a while--a long while.

Preflop: (1.5 small bets)

EP limps, MP raises, I find K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] on button and 3-bet, this actually clears the blinds (difficult to do even when 3-bet!), EP cold-calls and MP caps.

Flop: (13.5 small bets): 552 rainbow. EP checks, MP bets, I raise, EP fiddles his chips wanting to call, but MP makes the mistake of 3-betting, and I make the mistake of 4-betting before EP could act. EP realizing he's facing a raising war departs the hand. So after I 4-bet, he 5-bets with no inclination of stopping. How far do you go before stopping? I have about $1K and he has about the same.

Garland

Captain R · #2 11-12-2006, 08:48 PM

I just call down after 5-bets. Who knows what he has, but most LA crazy players are smart enough to guess what you have, and you have pretty much announced it here (AA/KK).

I play 20-40 at GC and Bay101 fairly often, maybe I've seen you there.

Nate tha\\\' Great · #3 11-12-2006, 09:02 PM

I think it's close between stopping now and getting one more salvo in. There are enough clues here that he has a very big hand -- the tempo of his betting, that your image is too tight to make this some sort of pissing contest, and that he's actually crazy enough preflop to have a 5 (or 22) here.

I don't think this sort of player is putting in this many bets with 99 or TT given how obvious it is that you have an overpair, and there aren't any draws for him to be overplaying, so we're looking at a range of:

QQ (probably)
JJ (maybe)
AA (definitely)
65s, A5s, 55, 22 (perhaps discounted some for preflop play, but not entirely)

I think you're likely a small favorite here but maybe only 55-60%, which generally isn't enough to warrant an extra bet going in since he'll likely 7-bet with AA+ but not with the hands that you're trailing. Plus you're in position so there's no chance of him making a weird check-behind and costing you value.

So, yeah, I think stopping now is very slightly superior to 6-betting, based on the information that you've presented. 8-betting is pissing money away.

jfk · #4 11-12-2006, 09:10 PM

He knows where you are (big pair) and you have no idea where he is. There's no sense in running wild here. You can easily be in a better spot soon when you do have the pure nuts or close to it when he'll make the same play. Wait for then. I'd favor just calling this one down from here.

I'm on board with Nate's summary.

Also, $5 drop...very spotted.

Chris Daddy Cool · #5 11-13-2006, 12:29 AM

the thing about your reads on the villian is that it describes only his preflop play. i know many players who give off the impression that they are idiots based on what they do preflop but play quite reasonably (and some quite well) postflop and you've really given no indication on how he plays postflop.

given my typical image i would squeeze off a 6-bet here, but you'd probably be better off just calling the 5bet.

Garland · #6 11-13-2006, 12:48 AM

[ QUOTE ]
the thing about your reads on the villian is that it describes only his preflop play. i know many players who give off the impression that they are idiots based on what they do preflop but play quite reasonably (and some quite well) postflop and you've really given no indication on how he plays postflop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Fair enough. While he has maniacal tendancies pre-flop, he does tend to play alright post-flop. He does make a few moves and bluffs, but he's not a total idiot post-flop (i.e. he knows that it will be a cold day in hell when my cards hit the muck pre-showdown). I know and understand this.

Garland

Smarty · #7 11-13-2006, 02:59 AM

Given his limp-re-raise UTG, I'd be more inclined to just call the 5-bet and the rest of the way down. I'd probably go another bet had he just raised and capped preflop.

Garland · #8 11-13-2006, 11:24 PM

I called down after the flop 5 bet. The turn came a blank and the river came a J and he showed 65o for another flopped trips.

I was wondering how far to take the raising given the information. Due to the responses I guess I played it just right. It was a judgment call whether to call down after 5 or go 6 and then call down as I thought were an awful lot of overpairs that could 5-bet that flop.

Thanks for your thoughts,

Garland