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#11
03-16-2007, 08:49 PM
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Re: rules question: dealer mucks a hand at the SD
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] ... and mucks his hand. she shoves the pot towards player B who shows KQ - the hand is behind on a Qxx board against player A's KK. player one complains that he had called. [/ QUOTE ] Hand mucked. Pot shoved. Hand shown. Now Player A complains? [/ QUOTE ] That was my first thought. These things have a tendency to change as they are told and retold. [/ QUOTE ] very true. i hope my other reply helps to evaluate the situation. 
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#12
03-16-2007, 08:56 PM
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Re: rules question: dealer mucks a hand at the SD
[ QUOTE ]
so how would you rule? [/ QUOTE ] Are any of the the players saying they heard him announce a call? want to hear the dealer tell me what it is he heard. The fact that the cards were mucked is of little concern to me. The only thing I think this depends on is whether I believe that the player announced a call or not. I am suspicious because of how this went down before the player complained. I think this is primarily a decision about the facts and not about the rules and these are particlularly hard to make when you aren't there.
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#13
03-16-2007, 09:03 PM
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Re: rules question: dealer mucks a hand at the SD
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] so how would you rule? [/ QUOTE ] Are any of the the players saying they heard him announce a call? want to hear the dealer tell me what it is he heard. The fact that the cards were mucked is of little concern to me. The only thing I think this depends on is whether I believe that the player announced a call or not. I am suspicious because of how this went down before the player complained. I think this is primarily a decision about the facts and not about the rules and these are particlularly hard to make when you aren't there. [/ QUOTE ] most of the players understood that player A ment to call. but it was not very clear and some observer were biased (they were friends of player A). in brief: i think it is more likely that the player said call but it is by no means certain. is it important for you, when exactly player A informed the dealer that he said call?
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#14
03-16-2007, 09:34 PM
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Re: rules question: dealer mucks a hand at the SD
[ QUOTE ]
is it important for you, when exactly player A informed the dealer that he said call? [/ QUOTE ] Absolutely. The reason is that relates to how believable the player is. Certainly I'm going to think his claim that he said call is more reliable if he immediately objects when the dealer starts to act in a manner inconsistent with his call. And certainly it is more credible if he does it before he sees that he had the best hand. If the player called I want to make sure that the hand plays out properly, but I also don't want to let him take a shot at the other player here by speaking unclearly and then saying he called when he sees he was ahead, but keeping the rest of his chips if he was behind. If I think he was taking a shot then I call it a fold and warn him to speak clearly. If I think it was just a n honest misunderstanding I rule it a call and play it out and warn him to speak clealry.
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#15
03-17-2007, 08:53 AM
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Re: rules question: dealer mucks a hand at the SD
If Player B didn't believe Player A said call, why would he table his hand? I'd hate to have to make this decision.
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#16
03-17-2007, 09:42 AM
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Re: rules question: dealer mucks a hand at the SD
[ QUOTE ]
If Player B didn't believe Player A said call, why would he table his hand? I'd hate to have to make this decision. [/ QUOTE ] yes, if player B wouldn't have shown his hand, there wouldn't have been much of a problem.
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#17
03-17-2007, 10:11 AM
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Re: rules question: dealer mucks a hand at the SD
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] If Player B didn't believe Player A said call, why would he table his hand? I'd hate to have to make this decision. [/ QUOTE ] yes, if player B wouldn't have shown his hand, there wouldn't have been much of a problem. [/ QUOTE ] yeah but player A's "call" never got put in the pot, right?
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#18
03-19-2007, 06:01 AM
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Re: rules question: dealer mucks a hand at the SD
[ QUOTE ]
If Player B didn't believe Player A said call, why would he table his hand? I'd hate to have to make this decision. [/ QUOTE ] From the OP it sounds like Player B might have tabled his own hand to show that his move was a bluff since player A said "I think you've got aces" - some players like to show up the opposition when they run a successful bluff...
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#19
03-20-2007, 01:56 PM
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Re: rules question: dealer mucks a hand at the SD
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] If Player B didn't believe Player A said call, why would he table his hand? I'd hate to have to make this decision. [/ QUOTE ] yes, if player B wouldn't have shown his hand, there wouldn't have been much of a problem. [/ QUOTE ] yeah but player A's "call" never got put in the pot, right? [/ QUOTE ] that is correct. or at least not before the decission of the tournament director.
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