Stars VIP Wild speculation

[Henry17]

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I don't think I can make Elite, but I don't have any incentive to go past 500k so I'm not really going to try.


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I agree. I'm just screwing around till Jan 2 because having started late I have no hope of making SNE. I am sure many SN who hit 500k feel the same way.

[NewGuy]

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Cutting the rewards for 1000s in favor of 100 players isn't the direction we had in mind.
Scotty

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Ty Scottyy for making this clear. This is the Stars us plebian <200K Novas know and love. Most of us are not as vocal as the SNE and the almost-SNE crowd, but it's nice to hear we're being thought of too.

FWIW (even though I have ZERO shot at this), I do think PokerBoy's concept of another SuperNova incentive @750K (or 800K) MAY be self-funding.

If there are any SuperNovas who would have quit at 500K-600K without a carrot dangled, but they decide to "go for the 750K" carrot when the incentive to get there is added (MicroBob being maybe a good example this year?), Stars gains anywhere from 50-200K in extra VPPs of play as a result of the promo (i.e., ~$10-$50k in revenue)

On the flip side, Stars ends up paying for this promo for ALL of the SNEs and anyone who would have made 750K with or without the incentive. So while it's pretty easy to estimate the total cost, I guess it's very difficult to model the extra incremental revenue generated.

[1p0kerboy]

The difference between a player like myself stopping at 500k VPPs OR going for 750k is $50,000 in rake.

Under the current system, we would get $19,875 in rewards for this "extra" play.

Under my "Supernova Plus" proposal, we would get back $30,475 in rewards (without the multiplier). With the multiplier it would be a little bit ($5,625) more the following year. The total would be $36,100.

Basically Stars would still be making $14,000 off of every player who decides not to stop at 500k but to go for 750k. Plus they would have the additional benefit of having these players represent them in a major live tournament.

So when you say that this program could be self-funding you are correct. In fact, as previously stated, Stars could expect a healthy profit from it.

EDIT: These calculations are done using tournaments. Poker Stars actually makes more money in rake from the cash games, which is probably what most players making it this far play.

EDIT: SN+ would have to be a 12k tournament package for these numbers to be correct. Like the PCA or the WSOP.

[lunapark]

Right now I have 420K points...I have slowed down my play at stars so and I will just make it to 500K....if there was some bigger incentive I would definitely have played for 600K or 750K but I just didnt think it was worth it to push myself....Ive enjoyed the outdoors instead....
Just offering some feedback..

[Alobar]

This thread is stupid. It's just a few people coming up with ways to benefit themselves the most.

[MicroBob]

Alobar is pretty correct.
Obviously the players who think they can make it to 750k are going to campaign for more stuff for reaching 750k.
If pokerboy1 played at different stakes or the points were different or something and he was going to easily make 1.5 million VPP's then I think he would be campaigning for more stuff for 1-million and beyond and wouldn't really care so much about 750k.

I'm roughly in that 750k market too and would love for all that great stuff but I think I'm a bit more realistic that making everything more top-heavy for EXACTLY the kind of player I am might not be realistic and probably stands less of a chance of being seriously considered by Stars.


Other thoughts:
Scottyy - reserving the right to change my mind but my initial reaction to the drawing is OMG YESSSSS!!!
Encourages more players to grind out those hands each and every month I think. And the dead-weight players who just don't bother to show up that month aren't eligible....as opposed to the freerolls where they can pretty much take advantage of the system without having to show up at all and having no real incentive to.

Not sure how I feel about the choice of $7500 value vs. EPT package at 750k. Don't the different EPT packages vary pretty wildly in value?


Henry and pokerboy - I believe you are both incorrect on the multiplier impact although I was only skimming so might have missed it.
But this stuff ain't retroactive, yo!!

After I get to 750k VPP's I have earned exactly ZERO more FPP's then I would have otherwise.
It only applies to the FPP's that I earn after that...mostly in the following yr of course.

IF they give me the multiplier for the entire next yr instead of cutting me off in June and IF I go on to earn another 750k VPP's the following year then I guess your calculations are correct.

[Henry17]

It was a PCA package not a EPT I believe.

Yes I did it as worst case scenario from Stars' perspective which would be someone getting to 750k by June.

My goal for next year is 1.5-2.0M so the 750k stuff is purely academic to me. I do think there is too much of a gap there. I don't really know what the distribution of SNs is but I have a feeling that it is bimodal with the first hump around 160-170k and the second at 500k. There isn't much Stars can do about the first hump but I think with some restructuring they could move the second hump.

[Big DP]

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What if (crazy talk again) the $50K weeklies were replaced with a once a month drawing for $250,000 for all players that earned 10,000 VPPs the month before. 1000 places paid.

Would you like this more,less or don't care?

Scotty

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Does this include players who are also non Super Nova, if so I would vote no.

Also I prefer my weekly showdown tourney (drawing) I laid out, but it could be monthly instead of weekly for a bigger prize pool.

[NewGuy]

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What if (crazy talk again) the $50K weeklies were replaced with a once a month drawing for $250,000 for all players that earned 10,000 VPPs the month before. 1000 places paid.

Would you like this more,less or don't care?

Scotty

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1) I would like this a bit less, but it seems a good effort at compromise to switch to a monthly schedule.

2) Personally, I would strongly prefer a $250k monthly TOURNAMENT (not drawing). This is POKERStars, not LottoStars [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

For people with scheduling conflicts on Sat afternoons, freeing 1 Sat / month would be easier.

I would also expect that people who do not want to spend x hours/week for a tourney giving them $Y in EV would be at least a bit happier if they could instead spend x hours/month for a tourney worth 5 x $Y.

3) The minimum VPPs/month seems fair, and a good way to prevent the value of the freerolls dropping from 2007->2008 regardless of whether they are weekly or monthly (i.e., if only 50-75% of SuperNovas earn their spot each month, then the prize pool is higher for those who do).

Edit: Purely for selfish reasons, and because I'm hoping to get the same EV from this in 2008 that I got in 2007, I would want the pool of players to be restricted to SuperNovas as in the past. While having Gold/Platinum be able to "buy in" by winning FPP satellites would reduce the cost of the program, I would hope this is a SuperNova-only incentive.

4) I might be a fun / marketable kicker to have the top X spots pay cash plus some large buy-in tourney seat (e.g., WCOOP main event seat or a "package" of WCOOP tourneys / W$s).

5) As far as the $ amount ($250k/month), if that is based on ~2,000 SuperNovas, would the prize pool be adjusted upward if the # of SuperNovas / people earning 10,000 VPPs/month goes up during the year?

[MicroBob]

good pt. I thought the drawing was only for SN's who continued to earn 10k VPP's.
Including all the plat's in there really kills my enthusiasm for it.

Also...PCA vs. $7500 at 750k would be pretty cool. PCA package is worth $12k I believe.