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  #1  
Old 11-09-2007, 03:35 PM
Apanage Apanage is offline
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Default I canīt play truly shorthanded poker

When Tryptamen asked about filtered stats in the other thread I looked in my databases and realized that I really really suck at playing Heads up and threehanded.
Iīm Having a winrate of 1.5 BB/100 overall with filtered for 2-6 players. But filtered for 2-3 handed I have a winrate of -0.76 BB/100. This canīt just be a rake issue can it?
3-handed I play as if every hand would have been folded to the button. Is this a mistake?And if so in which position is it the biggest mistake?
And if one would learn to play heads up where would one start? The heads up forum at 2+2 is no good since it mixes up the different poker forms.
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  #2  
Old 11-09-2007, 03:42 PM
yourface yourface is offline
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Default Re: I canīt play truly shorthanded poker

sample size?

to learn huhu play lots of hand and analyze your play away from the table. watching training vids will help too, DC has a bunch
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  #3  
Old 11-09-2007, 03:52 PM
Tryptamean Tryptamean is offline
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Default Re: I canīt play truly shorthanded poker

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...age=2&vc=1
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  #4  
Old 11-09-2007, 05:37 PM
mvoss mvoss is offline
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Default Re: I canīt play truly shorthanded poker

Yeah sample size is an issue here. You also have to play very well HU and table select really well to beat lower stakes HU.

Also, I have a lot of respect for your game so I mean no disrespect with what I'm about to say. It seems like you're going to need some rather large changes from your normal game to succeed very short-handed. The way you post pretty much make you sound like the posterboy for ABC TAG and you'll probably need to LAG it up quite a bit to make money 2-3 handed. Constantly stealing and defending with very marginal hands doesn't sound like something you're used to given your current style of play and this is can be quite difficult to learn. If you're a cardrunners member try taking a look at a few Scneids videos where he plays very short and see how far from your play his is.
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  #5  
Old 11-09-2007, 08:46 PM
Apanage Apanage is offline
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Default Re: I canīt play truly shorthanded poker

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah sample size is an issue here. You also have to play very well HU and table select really well to beat lower stakes HU.

Also, I have a lot of respect for your game so I mean no disrespect with what I'm about to say. It seems like you're going to need some rather large changes from your normal game to succeed very short-handed. The way you post pretty much make you sound like the posterboy for ABC TAG and you'll probably need to LAG it up quite a bit to make money 2-3 handed. Constantly stealing and defending with very marginal hands doesn't sound like something you're used to given your current style of play and this is can be quite difficult to learn. If you're a cardrunners member try taking a look at a few Scneids videos where he plays very short and see how far from your play his is.

[/ QUOTE ]

Youīre so right about my flaws.Iīm a sitting duck for a good LAGTAG.
But that is mostly a postflop story.
I do defend 60% of my hands against a standard TAG/LAGTAG button steeler.I do defend 85% against a SB stealer.
I steal 40+ from button and 30% from CO.
I do have very good BB/100 numbers from BB.
But even if I do all those things I mentioned above I mainly play in loose passive/aggressive games and that means that I donīt play enough hands in stealing situations even If I feel I play them correctly preflop.

But something changes when it is 3-handed and I canīt put the finger on it.It seems to me that the game doesnīt play the same as it would have been if it is folded to the button in a 5max-game.
For example do you only raise 40% of your hands from button 3-handed?
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  #6  
Old 11-09-2007, 08:57 PM
Absolution Absolution is offline
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Default Re: I canīt play truly shorthanded poker

Do people find that learning HU, even if you aren't great at it, helps your 6-max game. I find that 6-max has really helped my full ring game (which I rarely play anymore.) HU seems like such a different game since there is a flow that happens that you won't see in a 6-max game since it's not always the same two people playing.
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  #7  
Old 11-09-2007, 09:28 PM
Apanage Apanage is offline
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Default Re: I canīt play truly shorthanded poker

Well the samples are 600 K for the overall stats and 36K of them has been 2-3 handed. I think 36K is quite a big sample but Iīm not sure if stats converge quicker when playing real short than otherwise.
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  #8  
Old 11-09-2007, 10:56 PM
frenchpignouf frenchpignouf is offline
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Default Re: I canīt play truly shorthanded poker

[ QUOTE ]

But something changes when it is 3-handed and I canīt put the finger on it.It seems to me that the game doesnīt play the same as it would have been if it is folded to the button in a 5max-game.
For example do you only raise 40% of your hands from button 3-handed?

[/ QUOTE ]

The game don't change, but maybe the style of your opponents change. If you use their 6max stats like atsb or wtsd, you could be wrong. Maybe you don't 3bet pf enough. Your sample is not enough, there is more variance 3 handed. For the postflop just post hands.
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  #9  
Old 11-10-2007, 09:44 AM
Apanage Apanage is offline
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Default Re: I canīt play truly shorthanded poker


[ QUOTE ]

The game don't change, but maybe the style of your opponents change.

[/ QUOTE ]

That seems to be kind of an oxymoron.
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  #10  
Old 11-10-2007, 12:24 PM
Oink Oink is offline
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Default Re: I canīt play truly shorthanded poker

1) Make sure your PAhud stats are filtering for number of players.

2) Realize that even fish start loosening up when it gets 3 handed and HU. In a normal 6max game I am opening between 55% and 60% OTB. In a 3 handed game I am opening close to 75%. The blinds get looser and calls with looser ranges which actually mean you can play more hands as you will be less of a eq dog when they call.

I think DD has made some comments on this in some DC vids. Or maybe its something he talked about when he coached. Dont remember.


Anyway. Cliff notes: people play a lot looser 3 handed than 6 handed.
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