live misclick v. thetakeover 25/50 nl LIVE, 300bb deep...

[dlpnyc21]

Note: We are playing 7-2 for 200 bucks, if that affects anything.


Private game. Game is 7 handed, effective stack size 15k. Average raise size in this game is anywhere from 300-500 generally preflop, there has sometimes been a straddle, but not during this hand. Nick has been playing pretty high gear, and has shown down a bluff earlier in the night. The only hand we have played against each other so far was when he raised btn to 300, I called from SB with 77, flop 883, chk call 600, turn 2, chk chk, river 2, I checked, he bet 1100 and I paid off his 1010.

Not exactly sure how he views me, he probably thinks I'm decent.

UTG, a loose, active player raises to 225, this is an unusually small raise, and I wasn't exactly sure what it meant, I assumed a pretty weak hand (I think he would make it bigger with a stronger hand to discourage multiple callers). Nick immediately makes it 800 to go utg+2. He reraises more than most of the other players preflop in this game, probably has something like 30/20 vpip 7 handed.

I am sitting on 15k, he has me covered, I look down at JJ directly to his left in the hijack. What is the best play here and why? I have not 4 bet him this session, the only time I ever 4 bet him was another session when I did it with AK and I got it in v. his AK for 17k each pre.

I elect to just call. Is this poor? Surprisingly, the btn, also a more frequent reraiser, cold calls.

I am not sure what the btns range is here, but it's probably something like 77-QQ, AQ+. He is likely to 4-bet AK, KK+, but maybe not.

Nick's range is probably generally tight when he is doing it v. an utg raiser, however, the utg's small raise size may have been interpreted by Nick as weakness, as it was by me.


UTG folds. Flop is 10108 two spades, I have JsJx.

Nick checks. What is your action and why? If I am betting here, it would be partially a value bet, and partially an information bet. I am not sure my hand can withstand a raise from either the BTN, or a reraise if Nick checked. However, I thought it would be fairly hard for either of them to raise without a hand that beats mine.

I decided to bet 1700 for value, and go to throw out 3 500 chips, and 2 100 chips...

Accidentally, I make it 1200 (two 500 chips, 2 100 chips). This is a small bet into the approx. 2600 pot.

BTN folds. Nick thinks for a bit, and makes it 4k...

If I call, I am going to have approximately 9k left after my call for the turn.

What is the best play, and what is my plan for the rest of the hands.

Or, alternatively, is this an easy fold?

Thanks,
dlpnyc21

[dlpnyc21]

flop was 1088, not 10108, sorry about that.

[king_of_drafts]

I think the difference between 1200 and 1700 is pretty negligible, also I think the flop bet is pretty bad unless you are ready to play for stacks. Your range is sooooo polarized to JJ and QQ, maybe sometimes TT/worse pairs and AA/KK, but just about nothing else. Nick knows this and realizes he can probably get you off of anything except TT and 88, so it's an easy bluff for him to make, and you guys are deep enough so that he will almost surely fire the turn again (meaning, if you aren't folding, I would just call here).

Three-way flops play more timidly than heads-up ones so I think the best line is to check and hope for a blank turn (on which I'd happily check again).

[dlpnyc21]

umm---fwiw i'd frequently cold call here with AA/KK (not sure if nick knows this). If I check this flop, and BTN bets and nick folds, I am forced to chk-call at least one street, and play the hand out of position. I think the hand is a lot easier to play if I bet this flop. Also, I can get called by worse hands/draws.

Another thing is I give a lot of free turn cards to the btn if I chk call flop.

[dlpnyc21]

also, doesn't QQ bet this flop if you are nick, and AA/KK, while likely a part of his range, I think are less likely than average simply because he raised so fast preflop. He might have taken a bit more time with those hands, although I can't be sure. him checkraising here with qq also doesn't make much sense....

[Ship Ship McGipp]

given the questions in this hand, i feel betting the flop is excruciatingly terrible, like a monumental mistake

[dlpnyc21]

[ QUOTE ]
given the questions in this hand, i feel betting the flop is excruciatingly terrible, like a monumental mistake

[/ QUOTE ]

why--i think it makes the hand a lot easier to play. If I bet 2k on this flop, I take control of the hand, can represent a wider range, etc., etc. If I don't bet this flop, I am forced to check-call btn down a lot, letting him play perfectly.

Also, what would nick do with JJ, QQ on this flop? What hands would he play like this?

I think me betting 1200 (small bet) also makes this hand a bit more interesting, and probably widens nick's cring range here.


note: not to mention btn almost never has AA/KK/AK here.

[Pasterbator]

[ QUOTE ]
given the questions in this hand, i feel betting the flop is excruciatingly terrible, like a monumental mistake

[/ QUOTE ]

i agree.

If we check and button bets, we are generally ahead of his range, and we can play accordingly. However, by betting, you're building a big pot and pretty much letting Nick play VERY well against our range.

I'm not exactly excited about putting in 300BB with this hand on this board, and by betting the flop, thats what you're setting yourself up to do.

[EC10]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
given the questions in this hand, i feel betting the flop is excruciatingly terrible, like a monumental mistake

[/ QUOTE ]

why--i think it makes the hand a lot easier to play. If I bet 2k on this flop, I take control of the hand,

[/ QUOTE ]
why would betting 2k on the flop make it so much easier to play and give you so much more control of the hand than 1200 did? because betting 1200 certainly didnt help you at all did it?

[soah]

[ QUOTE ]
why--i think it makes the hand a lot easier to play.

[/ QUOTE ]

then why don't you know what to do here?