Two Plus Two Newer Archives  

Go Back   Two Plus Two Newer Archives > Limit Texas Hold'em > Small Stakes Limit
FAQ Community Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #61  
Old 01-20-2005, 11:45 PM
edtost edtost is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,971
Default Re: My thoughts... focus also on table stability

[ QUOTE ]
If you would've isolation-raised, it's OK to call here. Really.

[/ QUOTE ]

no its not.

do you see why?
Reply With Quote
  #62  
Old 01-21-2005, 12:56 AM
Pov Pov is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,026
Default Re: Evaluating Sites/Levels/Games and Tables.

[ QUOTE ]
1. You can't argue that I'm out of line worrying about being isolated by the TA when that is rare and then turn around and make this argument.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why not? They have nothing to do with eachother. Maybe you're misunderstanding my statement. I said isolate raise you OUT of the pot. I'm not going to be isolated myself by the TAG very often because if there are no limpers I will be open raising or more likely folding most of the time.

[ QUOTE ]
2. If you are in LP with a good multiway hand with a good, multiway pot, you can call cold when the TA raises--the large pot and great potential of your hand means that you are no longer in a marginal situation.

[/ QUOTE ]

Limping after several others limp knowing it *may* be raised behind you is considerably safer than calling cold hoping the bad players will call cold. Once again, I don't disagree with your logic, but I'd MUCH rather be in my version of the situation than yours - i.e. playing a lot of hands against weak opponents with position.

Admittedly, those times the TAG comes in behind me he has position on me, but I think I'm a good player and whatever edge he has on me is more than made up for by the HUGE edge I exert on the weak players that I have position on.

[ QUOTE ]
3. The only thing having the TA in the seat on the left buys you is the ability to check to him when he isolates you and then raise to build the pot (or bet into him to protect your hand). This is not as great as it sounds, because you sacrifice control of the hand to do this.

[/ QUOTE ]

While you may give up position when you share pots, the main point of having early position on the TAG is that you control the GAME by being able to raise first and isolate yourself with position on weak opponents. Calling cold is almost always wrong (IMO) so you force the TAG to play only re-raising hands or make a mistake or fold. Sounds good to me.

[ QUOTE ]
4. If you are instead to his left, you have the option to raise in order to protect your hand or call to build the pot. If you know that the players behind you will call 2 cold, you can raise anyway.

[/ QUOTE ]

Very true, but assuming they're the weak players, it's actually him I want to protect my hand against, not them. Put them in front of me so I can raise him out, not the players who will pay me off.
Reply With Quote
  #63  
Old 01-21-2005, 01:11 AM
Pov Pov is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,026
Default Re: My thoughts... focus also on table stability

If the TAG starts cold-calling things then he's become more like the LAP's. Maybe you run into scary TAG's more often than I do, but personally I have very little fear of this. Their position will cost me some small amount of money unless they are really THAT much better AND get the right hands to punish me with some time in the next few hundred hands. Frankly, I believe this to be a pretty rare occurrence though I'm willing to entertain the thought that I am just too cocky in this opinion.

In any event, this small amount I'm giving up is blown away by the huge gains made with my position on the weak players. This is SSHE country, not HEFAP. If I was trying to eek out 1 BB/100 against solid opponents at some high limit or in a big tourney I would totally want the good players where I could see them act first.

But this is loosey goosey low limit play and I want to be first in line for dinner, not the one getting leftovers.
Reply With Quote
  #64  
Old 01-21-2005, 01:17 AM
Pov Pov is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,026
Default Re: My thoughts... focus also on table stability

[ QUOTE ]
If the fish are on my left, I can get a check through with a weak draw and get infinite pot odds. With a strong draw, I can bet, feeling confident that most of the time I will not be raised and can raise my equity.

[/ QUOTE ]

If the fish are on my right, I can get a check through with a weak draw and get infinite pot odds. With a strong draw, I can bet, feeling confident that most of the time I will not be raised and can raise my equity.

Only the fish are more likely to check with an aggressive player behind them than they are after you've shown weakness by checking first. You do lose out on some excellent c/r opportunities though.
Reply With Quote
  #65  
Old 01-21-2005, 01:48 AM
witeknite witeknite is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Hitting the broom
Posts: 880
Default Re: My thoughts... focus also on table stability

I was starting to type a nice long reply, but I figure what's the point. You do what you want to do. I tell you what though. You can sit on my left all day long and CC my raises. Sounds like a fun table.

I just ask that everyone think about the logic of the situations presented and come to your own conclusions. Don't take anyone else's word for it.

WiteKnite
Reply With Quote
  #66  
Old 01-21-2005, 03:37 PM
lostinthought lostinthought is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 991
Default Re: My thoughts... focus also on table stability

[ QUOTE ]

I just ask that everyone think about the logic of the situations presented and come to your own conclusions. Don't take anyone else's word for it.

WiteKnite

[/ QUOTE ]

isn't that what most people do here anyways?
no reason to state the obvious.

haha. what a hypocrite I am.
Reply With Quote
  #67  
Old 03-18-2005, 03:37 PM
KaiShin KaiShin is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: thanks for all the fish
Posts: 1,401
Default Re: Evaluating Sites/Levels/Games and Tables.

Bookmarking.
Reply With Quote
  #68  
Old 06-22-2005, 09:32 PM
Bob T. Bob T. is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Shakopee, MN
Posts: 6,866
Default Re: Evaluating Sites/Levels/Games and Tables.

I don't think there is anything to add. Nice rant.
Reply With Quote
  #69  
Old 08-16-2005, 02:51 PM
AJay AJay is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Apex, NC
Posts: 68
Default Re: Evaluating Sites/Levels/Games and Tables.

So, let's say I'm going to play a couple of hours at night. If I'm really going to concern myself with table selection, I'll have to open quite a few windows and observe them for 20-30 minutes to get enough hand samples. And then I have to hope that a seat opens up in the right spot. Seems like a lot.

I would suggest, rather, just sit down. Play. Consider your table position while playing, and leave if it's poor. Just like you'd leave a table full of TAGs or stay at one full of LPPs.

(Another alternative I saw was to sit down at a table by yourself and wait for people to come to you...some claim this works well if you can handle short handed play well.)
Reply With Quote
  #70  
Old 09-13-2005, 12:31 PM
Mempho Mempho is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: $45,496 from Home
Posts: 1,355
Default Re: Evaluating Sites/Levels/Games and Tables.

A very deserving bizzump
Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:20 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.