The impact of scientific illiteracy in America

[flipdeadshot22]

I found the following stats very saddening, but at the same time enlightening, as to the intellectual makeup of the bulk of our American society:

"This level of science illiteracy may explain why over 40 percent of Americans do not believe in evolution and about 20 percent, when asked if the earth orbits the sun or vice versa, say it's the sun that does the orbiting"

http://www.technologyreview.com/blog/duncan/17535/

What future impacts do you see for a society with this amount of widespread ignorance, and what can be done to fix this situation?

[Borodog]

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What future impacts do you see for a society with this amount of widespread ignorance,

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Further increase in the size and power of government, as well as its intervention in and control of people's lives.

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and what can be done to fix this situation?

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Most likely: nothing. In a perfect world: end the government interference in and monopolization of the educational systems.

[ChrisV]

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Most likely: nothing. In a perfect world: end the government interference in and monopolization of the educational systems.

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Wow. In what way would you expect this to improve the level of general scientific knowledge? A fully private education system would be driven in large part by a couple of factors:

1) Private sector demand, i.e. the private sector would want people to be educated in an applied way, that helps their on-job skills. Most industries couldn't care less if people think the sun is carried around the earth by a giant dung beetle.

2) Religion. Enough said.

In a private education system, I don't see what demand there would be for a good general science education.

[Borodog]

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Most likely: nothing. In a perfect world: end the government interference in and monopolization of the educational systems.

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Wow. In what way would you expect this to improve the level of general scientific knowledge? A fully private education system would be driven in large part by a couple of factors:

1) Private sector demand, i.e. the private sector would want people to be educated in an applied way, that helps their on-job skills. Most industries couldn't care less if people think the sun is carried around the earth by a giant dung beetle.

2) Religion. Enough said.

In a private education system, I don't see what demand there would be for a good general science education.

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Which explains why private school students score so much better than public school students in science. And math. And language. And history. And . . . everything.

[Silent A]

I think it's a little simplistic (to put it very mildly) to assume that if you get rid of public education, it will be replaced by private education at the same quality level as current private education.

[Borodog]

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I think it's a little simplistic (to put it very mildly) to assume that if you get rid of public education, it will be replaced by private education at the same quality level as current private education.

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That's not what I assume at all. I assume that it will be replaced by a vastly superior product, as is true of every other case where the market is allowed to provide the product instead of a soviet-style centrally-planned bureaucratic monopoly.

[Phil153]

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Which explains why private school students score so much better than public school students in science. And math. And language. And history. And . . . everything.

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BoroTroll,
When you feel like making silly claims such as "so much better...[in] everything", please have some facts to support them. Are you really doing a PhD?

http://nces.ed.gov/pubsearch/pubsinfo.asp?pubid=2006461

Also please note, that wealthy and educated families (which is correlated with intelligence) send more of their kids to private schools; and on the other side, public schools act as a catch-all for the ungifted and the downright stupid.

The best analysis suggests that there is little difference in the quality of education and outcomes between public and private schools; in fact, public schools come out slightly in front.

Thank you in anticipation,

Phil.

[tolbiny]

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The best analysis suggests that there is little difference in the quality of education and outcomes between public and private schools; in fact, public schools come out slightly in front.

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If you are going to make this claim then you are going to want to link a different study:
Cautions of Interpretations
"The implication is that the estimated effects obtained should not be interpreted in terms of causal relationships."
"This self selection may introduce bias into the reported comparisons, and this bias would persist even after adjusting for observed student characteristics."

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Also please note, that wealthy and educated families (which is correlated with intelligence) send more of their kids to private schools; and on the other side, public schools act as a catch-all for the ungifted and the downright stupid.


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Did you read the study you linked?

Student and School variables:
"NAEP results typically show a higher average score for private school students than for public school students... How large is the average difference in achievement between the two types of schools, after adjusting for differences in student characteristics"
The student characteristics they used were
Gender, Race/Ethnicity, Students with disabilities, English Language Learners, Computer in the home, Eligibility for fre/reduced-price school lunch, Participation in Title 1, number of books in the home, number of absences.

When these are not taken into account the differences between private and public schools are signifigent.
Reading 4th grade: 14.7
Reading 8th grade: 18.1
Math 4th grade: 8.2
Math 8th grade: 12.3
It is not until student and school variables are adjusted for that the scores come a lot closer. However (and this is if I am interpreting correctly) adjusting for both the student and school level variables leads to a major underrepresentation of the worst schools in both school systems. Considering how much better private schools score before these variables what it appears is that instead of comparing public vs private schools what you end up with is the top level public schools vs private schools.

[hmkpoker]

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Also please note, that wealthy and educated families (which is correlated with intelligence) send more of their kids to private schools; and on the other side, public schools act as a catch-all for the ungifted and the downright stupid.

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While there is some truth to this, the strongest determinant in a child's education is parental input (I believe this was discussed in Freakonomics). Parents are usually encouraged by teachers to spend time (like an hour a day) reviewing their homework with them and supplementing their education...roughly the same amount of time that a homeschooling parent puts into their child's education. Parents that don't spend time helping their children with their lessons end up with dumb kids. I was in a program for gifted kids in my elementary school, and all of us shared something in common: our parents were very active in our education.

Think this is crazy? Send your kid to school and take absolutely no interest in his education. Don't do flash cards, don't read to him, don't check his homework. How bright do you think your kid is going to turn out?

Quite a system. Twelve years, a hundred grand and more, and you STILL have to educate your own damn kids!

[Prodigy54321]

I honestly don't mind if people don't know jack about a particular subject..it's when they decide to form opinions concerning those subjects despite that fact..and when they make decisions based on those opinions..such as what should be taught in public schools..it is a danger to society