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  #11  
Old 09-11-2007, 07:55 PM
foal foal is offline
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Default Re: Be all that you can be

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Abraham Maslow tells us that there are two processes necessary for self-actualization: self exploration and action. Self exploration is very important, the deeper the self exploration, the closer one comes to self-actualization. Self-actualization results from our desire to actualize our potential. As the Marines might say “Be all that you can be”.


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But what does this really mean? It's too vague for my liking.

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I think that the area in which Western society fails most egregiously is in the matter of an intellectual life after schooling. We have a marvelous brain that goes into the attic after schooling is complete and is brought out only occasionally on the job or when we try to play bridge or chess.

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Our brain isn't used in socializing or working? I think it's silly to only relate "the brain" to academic study.

I do agree that critical thinking is an important trait to have. I don't know how much it can be taught, as people vary widely in their taste for engaging in it. I believe preference for thinking critically is actually considered a key personality trait by a lot of personality theorists.
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  #12  
Old 09-11-2007, 09:23 PM
Taraz Taraz is offline
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Default Re: Be all that you can be

I actually read an article a few months ago on teaching kids "critical thinking skills". Basically, it's not very effective. You can teach kids strategies for specific classes of problems, but it's very difficult to teach people how to "think critically". Classes specifically designed to teach students critical thinking skills only taught them how to solve problems that were very similar to those they learned in class.

Basically it was concluded that it is more important to teach kids about a breadth of areas and show them how they are inter-related. Exposure to different ideas and different modes of thought is very important.
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  #13  
Old 09-12-2007, 06:16 AM
coberst coberst is offline
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Default Re: Be all that you can be

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It depends upon what you calculate progress to be. We have created a tchnology that provides us with the power to destroy the planet. We have created a people who are rapidly eating the planet. We have just passed through a century that is the most despicable I can imagine. This is progress?

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You moved the target. I was specifically referring to progress in education.

I don't disagree with you on the importance of teaching critical thinking. I just don't agree with all the "we suck" rhetoric that comes along with it.

Please suggest a culture past or present that did or does a better job of teaching critical thinking to the masses than western style society.

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It is possible that primitive humans had a better society, I am not sure, I am studying the possibility. The question is not is there any culture that has done better but the question is do we have the brains to do a lot better.

I am convinced that we have the brains to do much better. Our educational system teaches us to be good producers and consumers who are not capaable of doing critical thinking.
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  #14  
Old 09-12-2007, 06:18 AM
coberst coberst is offline
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Default Re: Be all that you can be

foal

I have decided that Critical Thinking can usefully be thought of as ‘philosophy light’. I am a retired engineer and have an MA in philosophy. More importantly I am a self-actualizing self-learner and I have learned the significance and importance of CT and of philosophy.

CT is an acronym for Critical Thinking. Everybody considers themselves to be a critical thinker. That is why we need to differentiate among different levels of critical thinking.

Most people fall in the category that I call Reagan thinkers—trust but verify. Then there are those who have taken the basic college course taught by the philosophy dept that I call Logic 101. This is a credit course that teaches the basic principles of reasoning. Of course, a person need not take the college course and can learn the matter on their own effort, but I suspect few do that.

The third level I call CT (Critical Thinking). CT includes the knowledge of Logic 101 and also the knowledge that focuses upon the intellectual character and attitude of critical thinking. It includes knowledge regarding the ego and social centric forces that impede rational thinking.

Most decisions we have to make are judgment calls. A judgment call is made when we must make a decision when there is no “true” or “false” answers. When we make a judgment call our decision is bad, good, or better.

Many factors are involved: there are the available facts, assumptions, skills, knowledge, and especially personal experience and attitude. I think that the two most important elements in the mix are personal experience and attitude.

When we study math we learn how to use various algorithms to facilitate our skill in dealing with quantities. If we never studied math we could deal with quantity on a primary level but our quantifying ability would be minimal. Likewise with making judgments; if we study the art and science of good judgment we can make better decisions and if we never study the art and science of judgment our decision ability will remain minimal.

I am convinced that a fundamental problem we have in this country (USA) is that our citizens have never learned the art and science of good judgment. Before the recent introduction of CT into our schools and colleges our young people have been taught primarily what to think and not how to think. All of us graduated with insufficient comprehension of the knowledge, skills, and attitude necessary for the formulation of good judgment. The result of this inability to make good judgment is evident and is dangerous.

I am primarily interested in the judgment that adults exercise in regard to public issues. Of course, any improvement in judgment generally will affect both personal and community matters.

To put the matter into a nut shell:
1. Normal men and women can significantly improve their ability to make judgments.
2. CT is the domain of knowledge that delineates the knowledge, skills, and intellectual character demanded for good judgment.
3. CT has been introduced into our schools and colleges slowly in the last two or three decades.
4. Few of today’s adults were ever taught CT.
5. I suspect that at least another two generations will pass before our society reaps significant rewards resulting from teaching CT to our children.
6. Can our democracy survive that long?
7. I think that every effort must be made to convince today’s adults that they need to study and learn CT on their own. I am not suggesting that adults find a teacher but I am suggesting that adults become self-actualizing learners.
8. I am convinced that learning the art and science of Critical Thinking is an important step toward becoming a better citizen in today’s democratic society.
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  #15  
Old 09-12-2007, 09:17 AM
TimM TimM is offline
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Default Re: Be all that you can be

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It is possible that primitive humans had a better society, I am not sure, I am studying the possibility.

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If you can consider this, you have to place a very low value on individual life and happiness. For one thing, how could you say that it is possible that it would be better to live in a time when simple infections and injuries, easily treated today, were just death sentences back then.

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I am convinced that we have the brains to do much better. Our educational system teaches us to be good producers and consumers who are not capaable of doing critical thinking.

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Most people have other concerns they would rather focus on. You can try to teach critical thinking all you want, but when thinking itself is stigmatized among a large segment of the population, you aren't going to get very far. We have to address that first.
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  #16  
Old 09-12-2007, 09:41 AM
ChrisV ChrisV is offline
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Default Re: Be all that you can be

[ QUOTE ]
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It depends upon what you calculate progress to be. We have created a tchnology that provides us with the power to destroy the planet. We have created a people who are rapidly eating the planet. We have just passed through a century that is the most despicable I can imagine. This is progress?

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You moved the target. I was specifically referring to progress in education.

I don't disagree with you on the importance of teaching critical thinking. I just don't agree with all the "we suck" rhetoric that comes along with it.

Please suggest a culture past or present that did or does a better job of teaching critical thinking to the masses than western style society.

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It's nothing to do with Western/Nonwestern. One reason the United States does poorly in critical thinking is that it is strongly religious and hence opposed to critical thinking in some areas. In particular, religious people are brought up to believe everything told to them by authority figures. This might seem like armchair psychology, but reflect on the fact that a recent poll showed that 40% of American Republicans still believe that Saddam Hussein personally planned 9/11. That's an absolute disgrace that requires some kind of explanation. I don't think you'd find that level of ignorance on anything so important in Australia. The first reaction of Australians to what they are told by politicians or the media is generally skepticism.
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  #17  
Old 09-12-2007, 10:24 AM
coberst coberst is offline
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Default Re: Be all that you can be


Tim

I place a very high value upon individual life and happiness. Because I do so is my reason for trying to comprehend why we do the things we do and if it is possible for us to do better. I think history plainly tells us that we are doing an extremely poor job in developing a proper world. Our ignorance and apathy allows us to live in our illusions and makes it extremely difficult to comprehend what a world we have created.

I am trying, here in this forum, to do as you suggest “You can try to teach critical thinking all you want, but when thinking itself is stigmatized among a large segment of the population, you aren't going to get very far. We have to address that first.”
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  #18  
Old 09-12-2007, 10:27 AM
coberst coberst is offline
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Default Re: Be all that you can be

Chris

The problem is not religion, the problem is the anti-intellectual attitudes of the vast majority of the population in the US and their ignorance and apathy.
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  #19  
Old 09-12-2007, 07:57 PM
tame_deuces tame_deuces is offline
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Default Re: Be all that you can be


The problem is more likely a gross over-simplification and and strong use of stereotypes. Sorry for the harsh words but the old 'people are stupid' argument I hear people who like to think of themselves as 'intellectuals' use over and over again grows old. It is far more probable that people are just people, and that these intellectuals should worry about more what they can do than what everybody else should do.
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  #20  
Old 09-13-2007, 12:56 AM
happywhere happywhere is offline
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Default Re: Be all that you can be

I agree with you.
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