Video: Joe Tall vs DeathDonkey 2/4 HU with Holecard Camera!

[MickeyWins]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Enjoy!

[/ QUOTE ]

I am! Seeing all the hole cards is a riot. In bridge they call that "double dummy." Read into that what you will! lol




Tommy

[/ QUOTE ]

Mr Angelo....
Could you be talked into doing a guest video on Dueces..??
or article....or any damn thing you want....even bridge...

well would/could ya?

[NNNNOOOOONAN]

highlights:

1. "queen hi is definitely the nuts on this bode...........nope."

2. both players losing and expecting people to buy coaching from them.

[img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]


actually guys that was one of the best videos i've ever seen. awesome description of thought processes or whatever.

i'm not much of a sucker for buying what i see on commercials, but you might actually have gotten a new customer out of me, just with this video.


*i just wanted to say that that sounded kind of cheesy, and i want to inform everyone that i have never talked to either of these players and have no stake in and cracked deuces or their subsidiaries.

[iplayscared]

wtf are those cards on the bottom left?


nvm

edit: how do you know what his cards were every hand...

[inferno]

Joe, what is your policy on 3betting the flop w/middle pair. I have seen you doing that allot.

Also how can anyone ever beat you when you read those hands so well?

ps.check your mail [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

[Joe Tall]

[ QUOTE ]
wtf are those cards on the bottom left?


nvm

edit: how do you know what his cards were every hand...

[/ QUOTE ]

What you see is post-production using our Hole Card Camera technology. We have several videos using the Hold Card Camera including a "DeucesCracked Home Game" where you can see all the cards in a full ring game, just like the WPT.

[Garland]

Great video! I’ve played limit heads up online a couple of years ago, and have a different perspective of it nowadays. Now I only get the chance live when a game breaks down and the opponent gets stubborn and wants to play me 1 on 1. Great analysis by JoeTall. It would be interesting to have a parallel video from DeathDonkey’s perspective. I have some notes with times for reference. Obviously I get to see both hole cards, so I may be biased, but take this as it is.

Notes: [DD = DeathDonkey, Joe = JoeTall (not to get confused with JT and Jack-Ten, heh) ]

Interesting that DD was playing ATC style (did he ever fold pre-flop? Note: yes three times - 32o twice and 42o once), while Joe had periods switching back and forth between playing ATC and folding some hands pre. Not saying it’s right or wrong, just interesting.

1:30 - Marginal flop peel by DD with JTs on 53K flop with backdoor spade draw to a Joe check-raise. Standard?

11:20 - Surprising cap by DD OOP with 75 on 3J4 with just a gutshot vs Joe’s J6. Seems Joe is looking up anything after his flop 3-bet.

11:37 - Didn’t understand why you didn’t like flop call with 94 on 3T9 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], and thought the turn was a definite bet. Overcards, gutshots and flush draws get free shots with turn check.

16:40 - Marginal peel by DD with K7 on 29A flop facing a check-raise, but this time with a backdoor nut flush draw.

19:20 - Nice read by DD to check-raise turn with just a 7 reading right through Joe’s flop check “knowing” he didn’t turn an A.

24:10 - Surprised DD didn’t play K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] more hard on flop with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] flop. Thought it might be worthy of a flop raise at least, and a potential cap. Hides the times you actually have an A and play that hard as well.

27:20 - Given previous action, Joe made a very questionable river value bet with J6 on K36 7 Q board after DD checked river with K7. I was going to say DD played it badly by checking the river, but then Joe played it even worse by betting it! Good fold by Joe in the end though.

33:40 - AJo not 4-betting preflop in position. I think it’s ok as a change-up, but it is a standard 4-bet.

45:00 – Don’t mind the turn check-raise attempt. Didn’t like the river check with AA by Joe. I thought that was a clear value bet. I guess he thought he was inducing DD to bluff the river.

50:25 - Surprised by DD check-raise river with QQ and pay off 3-bet on Joe’s trips. I thought he was playing it safe on the turn, by check-calling turn and river. Since Joe was possibly representing a draw on the flop and turn, I thought a turn check-raise was the more appropriate street to charge the potential draws. Calling river 3-bet was definitely marginal as I hadn’t seen a big street 3-bet bluff yet by either player.

52:00 - Didn’t like DD’s check on turn when he gets 2 pair with Q6 giving a free card after DD check-raised the flop. Value bet, value bet. Joe is looking you up light, but not betting the turn on a pure bluff as far as I recall, and may be prone to folding a small pair on the turn to the check-raise.

56:30 - DD another marginal flop peel with 97o with Q26 board after Joe 3-bet DD’s pre-flop raise. Did pick up a marginal backdoor diamond draw on turn.

Otherwise, well-played by both participants. Came away with some things to learn there on the rare occasion I play live and the game breaks down to two. Too bad they don’t let you straddle on the button like brick and mortar, huh?

$54 won by Full Tilt (before rakeback). Game selection, guys [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

Garland

[Joe Tall]

Garland,

When you are saying "you" I assume you are talking about DD?

[ QUOTE ]
27:20 - Given previous action, Joe made a very questionable river value bet with J6 on K36 7 Q board after DD checked river with K7. I was going to say DD played it badly by checking the river, but then Joe played it even worse by betting it! Good fold by Joe in the end though.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are being results oriented here, I feel. You'd be surprised on how often DD has a 3 or a lesser 6.

[Garland]

[ QUOTE ]
Garland,

When you are saying "you" I assume you are talking about DD?

[ QUOTE ]
27:20 - Given previous action, Joe made a very questionable river value bet with J6 on K36 7 Q board after DD checked river with K7. I was going to say DD played it badly by checking the river, but then Joe played it even worse by betting it! Good fold by Joe in the end though.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are being results oriented here, I feel. You'd be surprised on how often DD has a 3 or a lesser 6.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hi Joe,

Obviously I could be biased as prefaced before critiquing seeing both sets of hole cards, but I don't feel I'm results oriented here. I fail to see the "you" ambiguity in the quoted segment. I referenced both Joe and DD in that entire segment. Maybe you're talking about another hand that you forgot to include.

Let’s replay the hand in question:

You’re on button with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] and open. DD defends with 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (he could have anything except real utter trash like 32o or 42o). Flop comes K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. DD check, Joe bets, DD check-raise, Joe 3-bet, DD just calls. Ok I’ll buy that you can be ahead at this point.

Turn comes 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. DD checks, Joes bets, DD check-raises again! Now at this point I would have to put DD on either (a) a monster [keeping in mind that top pair is still a monster heads up] or (b) a semi-bluff of [I’m stretching here, diamonds?], but it’s kind of a bad bluff spot because of the action you’ve given because after you 3-bet the flop, you tend to get to showdown. In addition, he’s more likely to semi-bluff in position than out of position giving more weight to a strong made hand. If DD had a lesser hand like 3 or 6 weak kicker, he’s more likely to check-call you down especially out of position. Given all this, you should believe you’re behind when the turn check-raise comes back to you. Calling the turn check-raise in itself was somewhat marginal not only because you’re given 8:1 on a 5 out proposition (which is only slightly taking the worst of it), but also because DD represented the K on the flop, and now on the turn there’s a very real non-zero possibility of 2 pair including the K killing 3 of your outs with bad reverse implied odds if you catch two pair and then the line certainly goes bet/3-bet by DD and you pay off.

Well, now you called the turn check-raise. And if I do, it’s with the intent of folding to a river bet unimproved. River: Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. When DD checks the river, I’m really happy to see the showdown. I strongly suspect DD is either trapping or giving up on his bluff and turbo-mucking to a bet and there is no pay-off. But you just had to bet it, huh? [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Whew, a lot of analysis for one hand, but do you see where I’m coming from? Yes, I can see his K7, but even without it, DD has taken such a strong line here that given he hasn’t been out of line OOP in big bet streets, I’d give him respect and fold to the turn check-raise.

Garland

[Garland]

I also just realized that DD was going for the trifecta, but it's always been my belief that it's a tainted trophy to acquire. For if you're actually successful check-raising 3 times, you're probably missing bets somewhere.

Garland

[geo8o2]

can u please explain ur thinking when u had J6 and u thought J high was good?