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#11
08-22-2006, 03:15 AM
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Re: $215s JJ hand (yes I reraised preflop...)
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I would raise a bit more and call anything, you are basically stuck when someone open raises from the cutoff here and has JJ beat. Had same hand today, although it was a button raiser, and they had QQ...so ridiculous. I would never call here, they are raising from way too late a position IMO, and we are OOP the whole hand. Sometimes the [censored] will have AA-QQ, sometimes itll be a coin flip, sometimes they will be crazy and have 66. Also they will fold a lot. If you plan to fold to the reraise it's probably some kind of mistake for you to reraise to begin with, although the raise you made was small enough so that they might call and your hand value actually has some importance. Honestly if I were you I'd just think "What would my avatar do"? [/ QUOTE ] What do you do if villain just calls your raise? How much more do we know where we stand in the hand? It seems like the hand is now even more difficult to play, because you have built a bigger pot with the raise and are still OOP. [/ QUOTE ] Thats why I said to raise more preflop, so its basically the same as moving allin, but perhaps making opponent think there is some chance you will fold, because they are stupid, so they decide to go allin with some garbage. JJ facing an open raise from the cutoff is just too much for me to flat call with these stacks. On the button I'd be more likely to because at least we have position the whole hand. 
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#12
08-22-2006, 03:32 AM
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Re: $215s JJ hand (yes I reraised preflop...)
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I would raise a bit more and call anything, you are basically stuck when someone open raises from the cutoff here and has JJ beat. Had same hand today, although it was a button raiser, and they had QQ...so ridiculous. I would never call here, they are raising from way too late a position IMO, and we are OOP the whole hand. Sometimes the [censored] will have AA-QQ, sometimes itll be a coin flip, sometimes they will be crazy and have 66. Also they will fold a lot. If you plan to fold to the reraise it's probably some kind of mistake for you to reraise to begin with, although the raise you made was small enough so that they might call and your hand value actually has some importance. Honestly if I were you I'd just think "What would my avatar do"? [/ QUOTE ] What do you do if villain just calls your raise? How much more do we know where we stand in the hand? It seems like the hand is now even more difficult to play, because you have built a bigger pot with the raise and are still OOP. [/ QUOTE ] Thats why I said to raise more preflop, so its basically the same as moving allin, but perhaps making opponent think there is some chance you will fold, because they are stupid, so they decide to go allin with some garbage. JJ facing an open raise from the cutoff is just too much for me to flat call with these stacks. On the button I'd be more likely to because at least we have position the whole hand. [/ QUOTE ] I just think that committing ourselves to the hand is not that great. I don't see many hands pushing over us that we can beat, outside of AK, in which case we are flipping. Maybe I am giving too much credit to the average villain, but this is a $215, so I wouldn't expect too many crazy all ins here.
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#14
08-22-2006, 11:13 AM
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Re: $215s JJ hand (yes I reraised preflop...)
I would call, but that's b/c I play the 33s and re-raising to say 600 or so is not "the same as moving all-in." You get called a ton by 55/KQ/etc. Then you're seeing a $1200 flop with $1300 left in your stack and it's pretty tough to maneuvre.
Actually, at the $33s I would probably just push now that I think about it. I suppose at the $215s, a big re-raise here is rarely just called?
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#15
08-22-2006, 11:29 AM
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Re: $215s JJ hand (yes I reraised preflop...)
[ QUOTE ]
I would call, but that's b/c I play the 33s and re-raising to say 600 or so is not "the same as moving all-in." You get called a ton by 55/KQ/etc. Then you're seeing a $1200 flop with $1300 left in your stack and it's pretty tough to maneuvre. Actually, at the $33s I would probably just push now that I think about it. I suppose at the $215s, a big re-raise here is rarely just called? [/ QUOTE ] At the $33s I feel like a reraise is pretty mandatory, because you will get reraised by a weaker group of hands.
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#16
08-22-2006, 11:34 AM
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Re: $215s JJ hand (yes I reraised preflop...)
[ QUOTE ]
I would raise a bit more and call anything, you are basically stuck when someone open raises from the cutoff here and has JJ beat. Had same hand today, although it was a button raiser, and they had QQ...so ridiculous. I would never call here, they are raising from way too late a position IMO, and we are OOP the whole hand. Sometimes the [censored] will have AA-QQ, sometimes itll be a coin flip, sometimes they will be crazy and have 66. Also they will fold a lot. If you plan to fold to the reraise it's probably some kind of mistake for you to reraise to begin with, although the raise you made was small enough so that they might call and your hand value actually has some importance. Honestly if I were you I'd just think "What would my avatar do"? [/ QUOTE ] As usual.. I agree. Sorry but you just can't give credit to a CO raiser here for having JJ beat. Yeah ok when he re-raises it's a bit of a crappy situation but you have no choice. You can't just flat call here when you'll be OOP, it's no good it just lets him play perfectly on the flop really. I would flat call obviously on the button but in the SB? No thankyou. I'd call his push here and I would have raised probably something like t800, but I would have no intention of folding under any circumstances.
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#17
08-22-2006, 11:38 AM
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Re: $215s JJ hand (yes I reraised preflop...)
I would say that if this is youre line, which I agree it should be, you should re-rasise enough to commit your stack without shoving, ~725.
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#19
08-22-2006, 12:04 PM
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Re: $215s JJ hand (yes I reraised preflop...)
CALL BECAUSE HE HAS 27o.
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#20
08-22-2006, 12:27 PM
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Re: $215s JJ hand (yes I reraised preflop...)
[ QUOTE ]
what kind of bet would the CO have to throw out for you to view it as not a steal but as an actual representation of his hand? 150? [/ QUOTE ] Its not the amt of the bet size, its the strength of youre hand relative to the range villain is raising with. Its more about position in this case than anything else. The position villain is raising from and the position you will have to play the hand from.
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