Is vengeance legitimate?

Borodog · #1 01-02-2006, 09:00 PM

Imagine that a man murders your brother. You witness it, but cannot prevent it. Further assume that you are armed, but that the murderer now poses no immediate physical threat to you (say you round a corner to winess him empty his revolver into your brother's chest).

Are you justified in killing the murderer?

I realize there may be social consequences that might affect your decision to actually kill him (his brother might then try to kill you, the police may imprison you, etc), but whether you actually choose to do it is not the question. The question is, would you be justified in killing him?

yukoncpa · #2 01-02-2006, 09:13 PM

"Are you justified in killing the murderer? "

You aren't justified in killing him because justice and vengence are 2 separate issues. But if it makes you feel good and you don't mind the consequences, there is nothing wrong with you killing him for vengence.

Borodog · #3 01-02-2006, 09:24 PM

[ QUOTE ]
"Are you justified in killing the murderer? "

You aren't justified in killing him because justice and vengence are 2 separate issues. But if it makes you feel good and you don't mind the consequences, there is nothing wrong with you killing him for vengence.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why aren't you justified in killing him? And how is "There is nothing wrong with you killing him" distinct from "You are justified in killing him?"

Thanks for the reply.

yukoncpa · #4 01-02-2006, 09:29 PM

Justice is something that society agrees on. Our society has agreed that he should be tried.
Vengence only makes the person seeking the vendetta happy. I'm assuming you don't care about this persons future worth as an individual or his future happiness so what makes his life worth any more to you than a pesky ants.

hmkpoker · #5 01-02-2006, 09:30 PM

It all depends on the rules or objectives that we use as the basis of justification.

Peter666 · #6 01-03-2006, 12:38 AM

In the scenario you presented, of course you are justified in killing him. Do society a favour and shoot the bad guy in the head so you make sure too.

MrMon · #7 05-20-2007, 09:49 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Imagine that a man murders your brother. You witness it, but cannot prevent it. Further assume that you are armed, but that the murderer now poses no immediate physical threat to you (say you round a corner to winess him empty his revolver into your brother's chest).

Are you justified in killing the murderer?

I realize there may be social consequences that might affect your decision to actually kill him (his brother might then try to kill you, the police may imprison you, etc), but whether you actually choose to do it is not the question. The question is, would you be justified in killing him?

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe. If you live in a society in which you have no hope of obtaining justice through judicial means, then your only means to achieve justice are through a violent act. However, if you live in a society that has established a judicial system whereby one can reasonably expect to obtain justice for violations of the law, then the "right of vengence" is surrendered in exchange for "rule of law".

Lestat · #8 05-20-2007, 10:08 PM

I'm sure I'll be in the minority here, but I would kill the mo-fo. Is it logical? Probably not. Would it make me feel better? Yes!

Vengeance is a human emotion. Emotions are legitimate. So therefore, I reason they must be justified. My killing this particular thug might not be justified to you or other people, but it is justifiable to me, since he murdered someone I cared about and loved.

I STILL say capital punishment is justified. I just think it should be a close relative or friend of the victim who should pull the switch.

CallMeIshmael · #9 05-20-2007, 10:12 PM

I would have no problem with this person committing the murder.

Whether or not that answers the question of justification, is up to you.

Roland32 · #10 05-20-2007, 10:23 PM

This question is the basis for the formation of law. This body of law results, because the best interest of the individual is to have his vengence, which is also justified when applied only to a world consisting of only the individual and the villain. But it is in the best interest of society to have the vengence be handed down through a different notion of justice, as determined by the particular society. This justice determined by society takes the power away from the individual. It is this regard, the "costs" associated with error of the individual implementing vengence, that causes the "natural" formation of a body of law. This results in taking "power of vengence" away from the "mob mentatility" of individuals, and into a body of law that is more in line with the best interests of society.