Stud8 or Razz?? - Page 2

PokerJans · #11 12-22-2006, 02:20 AM

If you want to improve your overall poker skills...

stud8 and isnt even close. Razz is a nice game and all...but its really much more simple and straight forward.

I am not saying that Razz isnt profitable...because a lot of poeple suck bad at Razz, BUT it isnt nearly as complex as a game.

getfunky · #12 12-23-2006, 12:21 PM

i think stud8 is good for hand reading skills because of the additional reasons a player could be showing strength .. you're forced to think of additional ranges of hands, and it's fun to manipulate this when you, yourself have a hidden high hand that looks low.

*TT* · #13 12-25-2006, 04:12 PM

The best Stud 8 players were master RAZZ players first. Don't believe me? Ask RayZ - he discusses this in his split games book.

Also right now the Razz games are sooooo juicy, you would be a fool not to learn that game first. Also those who say Stud 8 will make you a better overall player are partially wrong, As Sklansky points out (and Andy alluded to) Razz is the best game to discuss basic poker concepts, thats why it is so often used in Theory of Poker.

TT [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Eulysses · #14 12-26-2006, 02:19 AM

Donk it up at horse and learn both. You can also learn o/8 while you're at it.

But in all seriousness I say stud8. Learning how to manipulate the pot in multiway action split pot games was one of the most rewarding and profitable things I ever learned.

2461Badugi · #15 12-26-2006, 02:36 AM

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Stud/8 games just aren't as good as, well, pretty much anything else online.

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I couldn't disagree with this more. Stud/8 is an extremely popular game among people who haven't the slightest concept of what they're doing.

If you want to learn lowball games, learn Razz. If you want to improve your high poker game, learn Stud/8. Stud/8 is like a boot camp for evaluating multiway pots.

2461Badugi · #16 12-26-2006, 02:38 AM

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The best Stud 8 players were master RAZZ players first.

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This is because the pool he's talking about was made up entirely of Razz players and Stud players. And good Stud players generally stink at hi/lo.

Andy B · #17 12-26-2006, 02:52 AM

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Stud/8 is an extremely popular game among people who haven't the slightest concept of what they're doing.

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The same can be said of essentially every other poker game. Most of the live games I've ever played in have been in the good-to-wonderful range, but the online games I've played in just haven't been as good.

Alex/Mugaaz · #18 12-26-2006, 04:39 AM

In my experience stud hi games are better than 8/b online as well.

TomBrooks · #19 12-26-2006, 12:11 PM

[ QUOTE ]
The best Stud 8 players were master RAZZ players first. RayZ discusses this in his split games book.

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Hi TT,

- Are you sure? I didn't see that, but I'd be interested if he did write that.

- I did see where he wrote on page 8, "Seven card stud is the essential foundation for stud eight-or-better, and without a full understanding of basic stud, the eight-or-better version will be difficult to learn properly."

Thus it would seem to me the logical sequence to learn the games would be Razz (so relatively easy, would be ridiculous to not put in at least some time with it), Stud, Stud 8; or, if one prefered, Stud-Razz-Stud 8.

PokerJans · #20 12-26-2006, 05:37 PM

[ QUOTE ]
The best Stud 8 players were master RAZZ players first. Don't believe me? Ask RayZ - he discusses this in his split games book.

Also right now the Razz games are sooooo juicy, you would be a fool not to learn that game first. Also those who say Stud 8 will make you a better overall player are partially wrong, As Sklansky points out (and Andy alluded to) Razz is the best game to discuss basic poker concepts, thats why it is so often used in Theory of Poker.

[/ QUOTE ]

I only play Razz when I play HORSE on PS or something but from my experience the situations you encounter playing Stud8 are tremendously more complex than those in Rzz. I do not care what Sklansky says...

IMO Razz is such a mechanical game where your play is so dependant on your opponents board. The games may certainly be amazing now and that may be good argument to learn Razz right now...but in the long run Razz is going to die out because the game is going to lose it novelty and only the experts are going to be left. They will then realize that they have almost no edge whatsoever and find greener pastures.