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  #1  
Old 11-30-2007, 03:38 PM
ShannonShorr ShannonShorr is offline
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Default Very strange hand from Bellagio $2500 vs Tom Schneider and Dutch Boyd

The following hand came up at the final two tables of last night's $2500 event at Bellagio. I'd like some input.

With 11 players left, I'm in the 1 at a sick 5 handed table with Chris "Bushman" Bush in the 2, Tom Schneider in the 3, Dutch Boyd in the 4, and a fantastic, deliberate young player named Michael Pesek in the 5. Tom has over 180000 chips, and Dutch has around 120000.

With 61000 in chips and blinds 1500/3000 (500) I raise KhTd to 8000 UTG. Bush folds and Schneider goes into the tank. While Tom is thinking, Dutch Boyd raises to 28000 out of turn. We call the floor and of course Dutch's action is non-binding. Tom is petitioning to the floor that Dutch's action should be binding. I see this mini-angle petitioning all the time live though, so I don't make too much of it. Tom finally settles on call. After a long thought, Dutch decided to just call as well now. Pesek folded.

Flop: Tc 4h 2s.

Dutch checks. I?............I have 53000 left and the pot is 29500.

--------------------------

Thanks,
SS

EDIT: To put Tom's action.
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  #2  
Old 11-30-2007, 03:44 PM
Cornell Fiji Cornell Fiji is offline
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Default Re: Very weird hand from Bellagio $2500 vs Tom Schneider and Dutch Boy

Your OP is unclear to me: Did tom call or fold?

I am pretty much willing to go broke here with TPGK and 2 PSB left - if not I don't think that your pf raise could be profitable at this table.

With 12 tun cards that we don't like I bet the amount most likely to get check-raised with air.
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  #3  
Old 11-30-2007, 03:55 PM
MLG MLG is offline
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Default Re: Very weird hand from Bellagio $2500 vs Tom Schneider and Dutch Boy

how can you put another cent in the pot?

cf, im assuming you missed that Tom decided to call.
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  #4  
Old 11-30-2007, 04:09 PM
puerilesenile puerilesenile is offline
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Default Re: Very weird hand from Bellagio $2500 vs Tom Schneider and Dutch Boy

After Dutch's out of turn raise and Tom's call, I think Tom's range is very heavily weighted in favour of him holding 77 to TT. After the flop, I would check behind to see what Tom does. I would expect him to throw out a feeler bet with 77, 88 and 99. So look to check-raise all in he bets. If he checks behind be very very scared. He turns up with a set a lot of the time so just check fold on the turn.
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  #5  
Old 11-30-2007, 06:58 PM
Annette_15 Annette_15 is offline
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Default Re: Very weird hand from Bellagio $2500 vs Tom Schneider and Dutch Boy

I'm def check folding... Toms call preflop is way too strong to even consider stacking off here. He was probably hoping that dutch would still reraise and that way he could get u into the pot or at least get a call out of a hand that might fold if he decides to reraise himself. FWIW, I wouldnt raise KT with that stack at such a strong table UTG but rather look for a spot to reshove on someone.

Annette
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  #6  
Old 11-30-2007, 08:36 PM
Todd Terry Todd Terry is offline
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Default Re: Very strange hand from Bellagio $2500 vs Tom Schneider and Dutch Boyd

I don't agree with the ruling, if Tom calls, Dutch has to raise, right?

I wouldn't put another chip in the pot. Tom has to have you beat here.
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  #7  
Old 11-30-2007, 08:45 PM
MaverickUSC MaverickUSC is offline
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Default Re: Very weird hand from Bellagio $2500 vs Tom Schneider and Dutch Boy

Excellent posts puerile and annette.

I read this hand in your blog last night and I liked your decision to CRAI flop. You get to see what Tom and Dutch are up to and it works well with stack sizes.

On the turn I believe your feel from Tom is the greatest deciding factor. Was his flop check suspect? If we're assuming that his range is 77-TT and he's betting 77-99, i suspect that it might have been suspect.

I like using words in the same sentence that are spelled the same but pronounced different.

Was dutch shooting an angle here or make an honest mistake?
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  #8  
Old 11-30-2007, 09:22 PM
AGame18 AGame18 is offline
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Default Re: Very weird hand from Bellagio $2500 vs Tom Schneider and Dutch Boy

c/f like every time........and this is a fold pre most of the time btw, as annette said, no point in r/f KTo with 20 bb's utg at a tough table, even short handed. Either of these players can have JJ+ here, and neither will fold on this board and rightly so.
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  #9  
Old 11-30-2007, 09:29 PM
Bond18 Bond18 is offline
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Default Re: Very weird hand from Bellagio $2500 vs Tom Schneider and Dutch Boy

Flop your kind of forced into a check fold.

I don't think i like pre flop. I want like 5 more BB's before i open here on an aggro table.
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  #10  
Old 11-30-2007, 11:41 PM
ASPoker8 ASPoker8 is offline
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Default Re: Very weird hand from Bellagio $2500 vs Tom Schneider and Dutch Boy

Preflop is a fold and likely a fold even with much deeper stacks

As played, check, and then fold
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