The PPA, lets talk numbers vs results.

[DeadMoneyDad]

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I remember once asking the PPA, as NH rep, for some flyer I could distribute at the proliferation of "charity-poker" card rooms in my state to generate new members. They e-mailed me back that they were working on one. That was 8 months ago.

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Forgive my intrusion, but haven't some said that the poker community needs to do more to proactively help?

Why didn't you come up with a flyer and submit to PPA for approval? Add the warning that you'd be distributing the flyer under their name, if they didn't get back to you in a month.

?

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My follow up e-mail was a request for authorization to make my own flyer, or to just copy one from the website at my own expense. I never got a response to that one either.

So whenever I play there now I just wear my PPA pin, and talk about the PPA between hands. Also, this charity-poker thing is quite a poker-positive development in NH, there is little reason to rock the boat here at the moment.

Like, TE, I see this situation slowly improving.

What have you done LL?

Skallagrim

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Well you shouldn't ever have a problem printing anything off the website and passing it out. I would be nice to have the ability to get some supplies like this through State Reps or such, but we're a little bit aways from that.

That was one of the reasons I first sought out a poker friendly printer.

As long as you identify yourself as simply a PPA member who is trying to help out "the cause" you can really do no harm with "educational" efforts.

I've suggested to John and Patrick the Grassroots consultant a number of ways to faciliate "avarage" members helping in "converting" freeroll members. The technology is quite easy, but the site isn't currently set up to handle this quite just yet.


D$D

[DeadMoneyDad]

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That's definitely how it was back then. I sent a few emails to PPA back then and got replies like yours, which was very discouraging. The changes since those dark days have clearly been dramatic. It's a huge turnaround, actually. There is obviously more room to grow, and I believe they'll do it.

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Is this any different than other new/growing lobbying interest organizations?

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Well yes and no.

It really depends on your prespective of the time scales involved. Most national presidential efforts start and end in the time the PPA has been around.

Move On and other such organizations exploded with a ton of money and effort right out of the box.

We as poker players, IMO, have almost the "Perfect Storm" of issues, timing, numbers, and potentially money to run a less than 2 year operation and be sucessful.

So if you want to be around as long as the NRA you would still have that option is there are enough issues left to keep people involved. I feel that there are enough people and "secondary" issues for a long lasting organization. But I'm not entirely sure the Poker Community as it is currently has the motivation for a long drawn out fight for every single poker issue both on-line and live.

That is why I favor a modified "Persidential Campaign" model geared torwards single issue advoacy.

We hit them hard in '08 and reap the rewards if possible in the legislative election off year of '09. If we are only partly sucessful in '09 we clean up with presure from a '10 effort.

In politics there is nothing wrong with planning for more than you can achieve, what is self-destructive is setting your goals too low. Yes way over reaching has its own dangers in only the hearts and minds of your members. As long as they understand the true objective and are willing to seek to over achieve then your risks are minimal.

As it is I have been constantly amazed what a well organized group of "average" citizens can accomplish when given the right foundation and simply asked to "lend a hand."


IMO,


D$D

[MassPoker]

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As it is I have been constantly amazed what a well organized group of "average" citizens can accomplish when given the right foundation and simply asked to "lend a hand."

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Personally, I see this as one of the "rewards" as an answer to your initial query. The PPA has stepped up essentially unifying the 50 states into one cohesive and unified body.

Lets be realistic about this for a moment; and brutally honest. Before John Pappas came on board, PPA struggled with some very negative administration problems. I think we can all agree on that. In contrast, we are starting to see some very positive things happening now, and I dare say that John Pappas is doing an awesome job in the short amount of time he has been on board. Given that, I expect we will see major "rewards" on both the State and Federal fronts very soon. Call me an eternal optimist, but I like the direction the PPA is currently going in. I, for one, see John Pappas as a HUGE asset to an organization that needed DRASTIC changes.

OK...Here's another question; Can you give me the name of another organization that is doing even a tenth of what the PPA is doing now for the rights of poker players? There have been several that attempted to "get off the ground" but really had little to no success at all.

D$D...your posts are very well thought out and thought provoking. You ask the tough questions and you actually make some very good points. I've gone back in your thread posting history, and I must say; I am very impressed. I'd think your talents would be a great asset to the PPA in my opinion.

Overall, the PPA has a precarious "past", but we are quickly becoming a very recognizable, and powerful force in the arena of poker politics. As the eternal optimist, I can only hope that we will see the PPA grow into a very powerful "voice" for all of us poker players in the US.

All In,

Randy C~
MA PPA Rep

[IndyFish]

D$D, I have to admit that I often "skim" your posts due to their incredible length. You certainly suffer no writer's block! But those suggestions you posted were brilliant. I'd especially love a PPA coffee mug to show off at work.

FWIW, I'm not saying your posts are without substance (far from it), just that they sometimes meander here and there on the way to the final destination. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[DeadMoneyDad]

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D$D, I have to admit that I often "skim" your posts due to their incredible length. You certainly suffer no writer's block! But those suggestions you posted were brilliant. I'd especially love a PPA coffee mug to show off at work.

FWIW, I'm not saying your posts are without substance (far from it), just that they sometimes meander here and there on the way to the final destination. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

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Who is your PPA State Rep, and what have you done for the organization lately is how I would handle that issue. With autorization I can have the PPA logo and motto printed on almost anything that doesn't move too fast.


D$D

[DeadMoneyDad]

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As it is I have been constantly amazed what a well organized group of "average" citizens can accomplish when given the right foundation and simply asked to "lend a hand."

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Personally, I see this as one of the "rewards" as an answer to your initial query. The PPA has stepped up essentially unifying the 50 states into one cohesive and unified body.

Lets be realistic about this for a moment; and brutally honest. Before John Pappas came on board, PPA struggled with some very negative administration problems. I think we can all agree on that. In contrast, we are starting to see some very positive things happening now, and I dare say that John Pappas is doing an awesome job in the short amount of time he has been on board. Given that, I expect we will see major "rewards" on both the State and Federal fronts very soon. Call me an eternal optimist, but I like the direction the PPA is currently going in. I, for one, see John Pappas as a HUGE asset to an organization that needed DRASTIC changes.

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I literally woke up with this post running around in my head bothering me and re-reading it I know why.

From the first time I spoke to John through my conversation with him this past Tuesday night, one thing has been crystal clear. The PPA is not lacking one iota of pride, commitment, and dedication from its leadership. From the few members of the board I have had much interaction with beyond John and TE here my firm feeling is there is not a problem with the overall goals and direction from the Board down.

John IMO works harder than many two people in this town given his age, experience, and ability to make more at a much easier task.

I have felt free to push John and the PPA in part out of my opinion of their complete willingness to not only take but welcome critics who also try to offer solutions. This is a rare quality to find in a single man let alone an organization.

The pride born out of the commitment to be the best possible single issue advoacy group possible has been clear from my first conversation with John and lead to my first post on the PPA in this forum, that if you all remember caused something of a dust up.

That seed should both always be nurtured and appreciated in any organization, as it is not something easily added or incorporated later on in the building process. It is either present and demanded as the price of entry or almost never permeates every action of a large organization.

When TE said he was going to send the OP to John I cringed, as I had spoken to John about the forums, the night before, and we both agreed he had neither the time nor the desire to read all of what gets posted in the open free wheeling discussions here.

So I don't post this to some how suck up to John, as I really hope he never reads it. I post this to again assure this community as I did on my first post on this subject, my personal read, that we have a very capable "leader" who's talents we should be daily greatful to have as a resource.


D$D

[whangarei]

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Given that repealing, amending, or otherwise exempting poker from the UIGEA has got to be the PPA's top priority, that most of their money is spent on lobbying does not surprise or bother me. Lobbyists accomplish most of what is done in DC.

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However, it is the grassroots efforts in those Rep's States that makes the Lobbyists job much easier. IMO we have convinced close to the maximum members we can on the logic and merits of our case. Perhaps there are more that can be reached this way but not enough with this method alone. You are going to have to show quite a few in the middle they HAVE to vote you way. If you don't someone else will at least convince them to sit out or worse oppose you.

Lobbyists are very good at getting the most out of what you give them to work with. Logic, reason, and even a few Billion in new revenue will only get us so far. Even that might not be enough given the multiple layers of opposition against us.

But a true grassroots organization with proven muscle changes the game in many ways and allows those top tier Lobbyists and consultants jobs much easier. Right now they are running the show because "we the members" and the PPA's lack of confidence in us has them make the lobbyists work too hard at the basics.

If we showed some strength as an organization, we allow them to put their best talents to work with the most advantage. Right now, we have a racecar sitting in traffic in first gear in terms of lobbying talent. We members could empower that magnificent car by giving it new road to travel.

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I do also believe, however, that motivating and involving our members even more will happen in the future.

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I am sure it will, it almost has to for us to move forward in something less than first gear.

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I personally would like the PPA to also involve itself more in litigation (like the ACLU and NRA do also), and have already communicated my specific ideas regarding that to TE. Having a central resource to help defend poker players in Court would be a great asset, both to the members and in terms of positive publicity.

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This is a very good way to show another tangible benefit of membership. This helps over-come the "what have you done to deserve my annual membership renewal" objections.

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As to taxes, I still dont see the urgency there; the Wexler bill is tax neutral for us, the Frank bill anticipates new taxes, but nothing specific is in there yet ... I dont think it a smart move to turn our back on Barney (especially since he is the "freedom" guy as opposed to the "skill games are different" guy) just because onerous taxes might be later proposed.

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Politically these bills are going to change as they go through committee and hearings. They are only the outlines of future legislation. They may currently be the upper limit of what the PPA and board feels is possible given the level of commitment out of your average members.

IMO we can and must try to do better. We may not get tax help, and it may be over reaching to expect it for sure. However, we need to also help the organization. We can continue to play defense and hope to get back to pre-UIGEA and not have to eat a ton regulation in the process. Nevertheless, if we are stronger we can move our "core" wishes and put the opposition on defense by making some offensive moves. Let them fight this battle on our terms not we theirs.

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The PPA did move, and moved pretty good, with the help of its local Rep Randy, to respond to the MA casino bill hypocracy ... that effort continues, so what else exactly should the PPA do D$D? I like the idea of more "grassroots" movement in general, but what are you specifically suggesting?

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I'll give you some examples of out of the box suggestions I've made that I think would have made a difference not only in terms of organization but actual cost savings.

Bumper stickers. I'm a campaign guy I was shocked that I could not even buy a bumper sticker on the web-site. I found a poker friendly printer and we designed and had printed 10,000 bumper stickers at near cost. I had hoped a good portion of them would have been on cars in KY. They could have put 500 of them on the website for sale at about $3.00 and if they sold most of them paid for the entire lot. We would have also made a visible presence just getting them on cars in KY.

Poker Chips. Grasshopp3r got a nice design idea going on this forum and had me carry the ball. Because the Million Chip March idea was seen as not politically viable as Ney got chips I suggested because of the price I negotiated that we have printed some commemorative chips and perhaps some chipsets to use at the Fly-in. IMO if you had auctioned off just half of them as autographed sets for even just the normal retail of lesser quality chip-sets you would have made money and still had a few chipsets left over. In the end the person responsible for the chips for just the pro players and Congressmen failed, and there was a scramble to just get chips for that small "big" game.

I would have used the contacts I had made to hold at least two MTT's as at least one should have included everyone who took the trouble to fly-in. As it was the "big kids" went off to the big game and the rest of us were on our own. I had chips, tables, cards, dealers, and people trained to run MTT events for up to 500 people.

In less than a week of effort, I had all manner of volunteers and resources, some may not have been needed, but I do know from having attended the event that the PPA paid for a number of things they could have had free. I know John was busy at this time and perhaps thought I was talking out of my rear about what could have been done, but facts are facts.

Fundraising. You could have any of the pros show up almost any night in this area and hold a PPA fund raising event and get a minimum of 200~300 new dues paying members. You would not even need major cash prizes. You had time to run at least 2 of these with a little planning during this fly-in. You have pros in town for the up coming Judiciary hearings you could set up to pull these off on a regular basis by now.

PPA Store. I have a couple of contacts that would run a "no touch" Store for the PPA. Given some of the item prices I was able to dig up, most of the time the store even using up to a 1/3 of the items for giveaways for other grassroots events would be close to break-even. Find the right person to employ and this becomes a potential profit center.

Organization. You empower through training the State Reps. You teach them how to motivate the troops. You give them a budget of items from the store or donations in kind to hold events linked to specific goals. For example Mass. If Randy has a few trinkets and the necessary contacts and help through training he could hold a training/organizing session and have a nice fun free poker event to reward the people who got involved. The next time he made the calls more people show up. From that he builds a core of people he knows he can count on. The combination of concrete action and spirit of fun builds an organization in MA that even Sen. Kennedy on the Senate Judiciary a Committee we have to go through would become aware of through his staffers.

KY. KY was the proving ground. You try out some of these ideas along with a couple of hundred too long to mention and create a training manual for State Reps for '08. Right now John's budget writing effort and concretely ability to demonstrate the value of the investment for grassroots would be a dream not a sales pitch based on hope. Between now and the first primaries you continue to refine that playbook and through training you know before the campaign season where you can make a difference. Your legislative lobbing efforts get magnified many fold. Greenberg and the consultants are not planning a Hill fight, but a national '08 strategy, looking at specific races on offense, not defense. They could be doing this with confidence not hope now.

Motivation. You create meaningful concrete visible efforts that are fun for the members. Fun is the key. You find creative ways to "reward" hard work of your volunteers. The biggie on Presidential Campaigns was always driving or even getting to ride in a Presidential motorcade, the next were the tarmac photo ops. There are thousands of ways to "reward" volunteers, as they are the backbone of your real strength.

Testing. You have to constantly test your troops. You have to get creative in constantly looking for excuses to see who is still engaged and can do the job. More importantly you have to test your State Reps. Sadly, to say I imagine some of them have been barely heard from. All need to be given the tools to be more productive than TE. Can you imagine what TE could accomplish with a little help? Yes some may need to be replaced. But they should be at least given the chance to excel first.

State Reps. You don't need 50 paid employees to keep an eye out for State legislation that might hurt us, that is a red herring. But you do need to train State Reps how to spot opportunities. Don Signore from Chicago is a prefect example. The PPA posted on its website his news story, but no one tried to get him or the bar league in question on the phone. I tracked down the league, as I had the nexus of a number of news stories posted on the PPA site, just to see if this activity was being done. I spoke to Don and John to see if we could get Don to the fly-in and make sure John had the Chicago paper's DC stringers to follow up on this "Mr Smith Goes to Washington" story. I even had to introduce Don to the Trib stringer.

It doesn't take much to get this ball rolling. With the proper motivation and a little campaign trash you'd would be amazed what your "average" person can do in politics. I know as there are people who have come up to me years later who got involved in an effort I was helping and told me they were amazed at what they accomplished. I am gratified to say some have become from raw political neophytes volunteers to campaign managers and very strong grassroots organizers.

As I've said there are two kinds of grassroots organizers the expensive and the ones who had to learn to "live off the land." We all want to be the well paid ones, but not all know how to get the most out of every buck they are given. Most of the time I've ended up having to raise the seed money for the ideas that ended up bringing in more then the initial investment just to prove the worth of my ideas, that approach sucks, but you often have to do it. There were people here willing to pay for the DC chips out of their own pocket just to make it happen. Why? Because someone asked them to step up.

It can be done. It takes hard work, but most of all a true sense of understanding the "care and feeding" of your volunteers. Volunteers are a strange group. They will follow you through hell, like hanging 100,000 door hangers in less than 3 days in the cold fall rain, knowing that because of the rain 3/4 of the people didn't show up, if you treat them right. In that, little adventure, there were people who showed up for a single 2 hour commitment and worked 10 or more hours all three days. I'm still very proud of that crew. But you misuse a volunteer core and that campaign HQ can get damn empty in a hurry.

IMO a concrete action that is seen as worthwhile and a spirit of having fun doing it are the keys. Figuring out creative rewards that don't cost a dime is the art.

Grassroots is not a job, it really is a religion.

D$D

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Seriously, D$D, I thought you were going to work on distilling your points. I can't even read your posts like this and I know I'm not alone.

[sobefuddled]

Well...a response to my e-mail regarding potential talk show guests for Dan Rea's show would be nice Randy. Even an acknowledgement that you received the e-mail would be nice. I work full-tme at a rather demanding job. I don't mind taking an hour or so a day out to help with your cause but an acknowledgement that you received some information would be nice given that the information was state-specific. It took me time to write the e-mail that generated Mr. Rea's invitation. Even an auto-reply would be preferable to no reply at all. If you had time to make this post you had time to reply to someone who is attempting to help you further your cause.

[DeadMoneyDad]

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Well...a response to my e-mail regarding potential talk show guests for Dan Rea's show would be nice Randy. Even an acknowledgement that you received the e-mail would be nice. I work full-tme at a rather demanding job. I don't mind taking an hour or so a day out to help with your cause but an acknowledgement that you received some information would be nice given that the information was state-specific. It took me time to write the e-mail that generated Mr. Rea's invitation. Even an auto-reply would be preferable to no reply at all. If you had time to make this post you had time to reply to someone who is attempting to help you further your cause.

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I suggest you, Randy, and the other in or near MA get together and start deligating tasks among yourselves. Share alternative communication methods so the main MassPPA box doesn't over filled.

One of the worst things you can do with volunteers is not put them to work when they are ready to help. They simply loose their steam and go away. This is a cardnial sin in grassroots organizations.

MassPoker you need to solve this problem, NOW.


D$D

[TheEngineer]

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Well...a response to my e-mail regarding potential talk show guests for Dan Rea's show would be nice Randy. Even an acknowledgement that you received the e-mail would be nice. I work full-tme at a rather demanding job. I don't mind taking an hour or so a day out to help with your cause but an acknowledgement that you received some information would be nice given that the information was state-specific. It took me time to write the e-mail that generated Mr. Rea's invitation. Even an auto-reply would be preferable to no reply at all. If you had time to make this post you had time to reply to someone who is attempting to help you further your cause.

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It could have either not been delivered or been deleted by his spam filter. Why not send it once more or PM him?