B&M SNGs: Availability, Rake, ... ?

[citanul]

Collin,

No problem. Your post just reeked of "I'm trying to put together a listing for a website/publication and don't want to tell anyone that." Looking forward to the book.

citanul

[cha59]

[ QUOTE ]
Colin,

The standard live SNG is typically held at a prominent obstetrician's house. Buyin is typically around 2k with a $200 rake that covers booze, strippers, and a big sub. Payout is typically 3 spots, but top heavy. Live strucutes are different than online structures primarily because of permissible lap dance breaks where you are not blinded off.

The field is typically very difficult, but it doesn't really matter if you win or lose (lol j/k. ship it) because all the money goes to Rhino and Skipperbob at the end of the night.

Hope this helps.

[/ QUOTE ]

you crack me up bones [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[TheNoodleMan]

P.S.
While meaning no disrespect, we fully expect it to suck like everything else that has been put into print on the subject.

[cha59]

[ QUOTE ]
P.S.
While meaning no disrespect, we fully expect it to suck like everything else that has been put into print on the subject.

[/ QUOTE ]

Colin seems like a very good writer and I havent seen him give any bad advice in posts (just my opinion). It could be interesting, but my guess is it wont have anything that players as good as you dont already know noodle.

[AMT]

[ QUOTE ]
P.S.
While meaning no disrespect, we fully expect it to suck like everything else that has been put into print on the subject.

[/ QUOTE ]


POTD (I also look forward to the book, Collin)

[TheNoodleMan]

I know I come off like an ass when I say that, but it really isn't an indictment of Collin as much as everything put into print to date on SNGs. I've read so much bad SNG advice in poker books that I've reached a point where my default expectation is for any book that deals with SNGs to be bad.

Even something as good as HoH went instasuck whenever it touched SNGs. This forum has blown away anything put into print on the subject so still have a healthy dose of skepticism that that the book that finally does it right is going to come from someone that is basically unknown here. I'm sure I'll read it and I hope its good because a solid sng book is long overdue.

[Josem]

[ QUOTE ]
their availability (where have you found them offered?)

[/ QUOTE ]
Crown Casino, Melbourne, Australia

[ QUOTE ]
common rakes

[/ QUOTE ]
Rediculously high

[ QUOTE ]
structures

[/ QUOTE ]
Rediculously short (start with 30bb; start of level 2 you have 10bb)

[ QUOTE ]
and levels of competition?

[/ QUOTE ]
Rediculously awful. Multiply online stakes by about 15-20 for equivalent live skill level.

(eg, a $5 online SNG would be about similar to a $100 live sng; $55 online sng would be similar to $1k live sng)

[ QUOTE ]
Also, were you allowed to choose your own seat, or was it randomly determined?

[/ QUOTE ]
random

[cha59]

[ QUOTE ]
I know I come off like an ass when I say that, but it really isn't an indictment of Collin as much as everything put into print to date on SNGs. I've read so much bad SNG advice in poker books that I've reached a point where my default expectation is for any book that deals with SNGs to be bad.

Even something as good as HoH went instasuck whenever it touched SNGs. This forum has blown away anything put into print on the subject so still have a healthy dose of skepticism that that the book that finally does it right is going to come from someone that is basically unknown here. I'm sure I'll read it and I hope its good because a solid sng book is long overdue.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. I dont think we'll get anything in it that hasnt been discussed in detail here, but it could be interesting and it might not have misinformation on SNGs like the HOH books. Then again it might suck. We wont know for sure until it comes out, but Colin is a good writer and seems knowledgeable about SNGs so far so I'll withhold judgement until I read it.

[Collin Moshman]

Hi Josem,

Thank you for the detailed reply, it was very informative.

As for the speculation about my book, no worries -- just give it an honest review when it comes out and I'll be content. I think you guys may be pleasantly surprised. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Incidentally, in HOH I there is only superficial treatment of the SNG, and it does come off as being slightly dismissive. But in HOH III there is some very quality material, including several consecutive SNG bubble hands that I liked enough to reference in my own book. In particular, I take Problem #38 of the workbook and give an ICM-based explanation of the result, and then go on to show why calling with K K in that spot is indeed +Equity.

Best Regards,
Collin

[Slim Pickens]

availability: Sporadic. A big room like Mirage might have at least one running most nights, and a variety of buy-ins on busier nights. Smaller rooms claim to offer them, but it's highly-dependent on the shift manager's feelings about SNGs.

rake: 15-20%, but you could beat the old Party 5+1's, right?

structure: 50 BB starting stacks, blinds double every 15 minutes

competition: It's not really necessary to look at your cards most of the time.

seats: They're usually, but not always, randomly determined.