"You're Freaking Crazy"

[RayPowers]

I have to say I'm pretty lucky when it comes to the wife and I agreeing on how to raise our children. We agree on how we should or should not punish the children. We agree on how to educate them. We agree on religious upbringing. In general, I'm very happy with how well we get along in raising our children.

Except the use of cursing. My wife is dead against cursing being used around the children, and I agree. But my wife has taken it to a new extreme recently, when I got this call at work:

Wife: The kids were playing, and Kaitlyn was making funny faces, and Randy just told his sister "You're freaking crazy, Kaitlyn."
Me: Ok?
Wife: I told him that it was not ok to say freaking.
Me: Why? Freaking isn't a curse word.
Wife: Because he's using it in place of a curse word!
Me: Isn't that a good thing? I mean, don't we want him to use other words so he doesn't use curse words? Would you object to him saying darn?
Wife: I don't know. I haven't heard him say darn yet.

And so on. The general answer seems to be that she feels that since he's using freaking in place of a bad word, it's just as bad. I feel that using other words in place of a curse word is simply learning to communicate better and more politely.

I polled my guy friends and they agree 100% with me that this is ok. My wife says she polled the girls at our Kindercare, and they agree with her 100%. I thought the lounge was a good place to get some neutral opinions from both males and females of maternal age.

Thoughts?

Ray

[Rubeskies]

[censored] that

[ChipWrecked]

He could go the Napoleon Dynamite route and say "flippin'".

I had to brake hard the other day with my three year-old girl in the back.

From the back: "Oh, f***."

[Blarg]

Your wife is being more reflexive than analytic. Common regarding anything related to kids.

I remember a friend of mine said nobody should say Gosh, because it was short for God, or Gee, because it was short for Jesus. I mean, Andy Hardy and Smurfs say those words already! This kind of thing can be taken too far.

Curse words exist. I agree with not saying them around kids. But pretending they don't exist is just pointless. Better to deal with them. Your example of "darn" is a good enough example.

What next, we can't say OW! because it's short for OH MY F*CKING GOD THIS SH*T HURTS LIKE A MOTHERF*CKER!!!?

[Aces McGee]

I think context matters a ton here.

It's not the nicest thing in the world to call someone "crazy," but in today's society, it is a generally accepted way to express disagreement with somebody else.

It is significantly ruder, however, to call someone "f*cking crazy," and not solely because of the use of a curse word. It expresses not only disagreeement with the other person's point of view, but also a certain disdain for that point of view and perhaps that person.

My guess is that your wife, even if she doesn't realize it, is objecting more to the connotation of what your son said, not the specific use of the word "freaking."

Depending on the context, a word like "darn" can be viewed similarly. If the kid stubs his toe and says "Darn!" it's not a big deal; he's hurt himself and it's a natural reaction to get upset about that. Saying "Kaitlyn, move your darn dolls so I can play with my trucks" is different; it shows disrespect for her and her possessions.

I'm afraid, then, that this means I agree with your wife.

-McGee

[SoloAJ]

This is actually a really interesting topic to me. I am against cursing in front of children. Mostly because if children learn curse words before knowing what they really mean, then they are more likely to use them in inappropriate situations such as in the middle of a restaurant or at school.

However, I'm also against curse words, in general, because I think they're sort of raping our language. So many people have tightened vocabularies thanks to the fact that "f***ing" can be used not only as a verb,noun,adjective, conjunction, exclamation, adverb (maybe? haha), etc....but also because people plug it in for all sorts of meanings within each category.

So yeah, I don't like how indescript things become when people rely heavily on curse words.

That explanation may seem a bit unnecessary given the original post, but I think it best explains my I am against it. And, as you may guess from my explanation above...Yes, I think that it is better (and okay) to use freaking than the alternative. However, I'd much prefer to have my kids learn useful adjectives and other words so they don't become reliant on "freaking" (and then later, reliant on "f***ing").


Additionally, I agree with McGee on the point of "freaking crazy" being a bit excessive. It is incredibly harsh to say, and something that children, certainly, should not be throwing around lightly.

[RayPowers]

Aces,

The internet sucks for intonation. The way my son said it was in a joking way like when you are with with your friends, having fun, and your friend does something outrageous and you laugh and say "dude, you're [censored] crazy, man!" [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I hadn't thought about the context discussion in the way you described it, and I think you have a good point. I just don't think it applies here.

Ray

[Aces McGee]

[ QUOTE ]
Aces,

The internet sucks for intonation. The way my son said it was in a joking way like when you are with with your friends, having fun, and your friend does something outrageous and you laugh and say "dude, you're [censored] crazy, man!" [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I hadn't thought about the context discussion in the way you described it, and I think you have a good point. I just don't think it applies here.

Ray

[/ QUOTE ]

I went back and read your OP a few minutes ago, and it occurred to me that might have been the case.

In light of this, I tend to agree with you more.

-McGee

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
This is actually a really interesting topic to me. I am against cursing in front of children. Mostly because if children learn curse words before knowing what they really mean, then they are more likely to use them in inappropriate situations such as in the middle of a restaurant or at school.

However, I'm also against curse words, in general, because I think they're sort of raping our language. So many people have tightened vocabularies thanks to the fact that "f***ing" can be used not only as a verb,noun,adjective, conjunction, exclamation, adverb (maybe? haha), etc....but also because people plug it in for all sorts of meanings within each category.

So yeah, I don't like how indescript things become when people rely heavily on curse words.

That explanation may seem a bit unnecessary given the original post, but I think it best explains my I am against it. And, as you may guess from my explanation above...Yes, I think that it is better (and okay) to use freaking than the alternative. However, I'd much prefer to have my kids learn useful adjectives and other words so they don't become reliant on "freaking" (and then later, reliant on "f***ing").


Additionally, I agree with McGee on the point of "freaking crazy" being a bit excessive. It is incredibly harsh to say, and something that children, certainly, should not be throwing around lightly.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, but since it's the spirit that's being critiqued, the words are not so important, and shouldn't be treated so centrally. If you want to critique the spirit behind words, it's the spirit that matters. You can say terrible things with wonderful words. So addressing the behavior seems more appropriate than worrying too much which words are used.

[pryor15]

Solo,

with a little creativity, f**k can be used as everything but a gerund (sp?)...and a pronoun, obviously.

me, i have no objections to common curse words like f**k, sh*t, d*mn, etc. i have a lot of problems with how our culture has turned them into taboo. i mean, [censored], it's just a word.

my linguistics prof in college used to tell a story about how certain curse words became taboo because when the Anglos or the Saxsons or someone (i have no idea which, really) conquered someone else, the new ruling class lived in the castles and whatnot while the conquered peoples lived out in the fields. so (to use a simple and probably inaccurate example...but you get the idea), the ruling class would call something p**p, while the lower class would call it sh*t. it wasn't a vulgar word in the fields, it was just a common aspect of their language. but, if you were to hang out in the castle, you couldn't use the vernacular of the peasants, naturally, as that was considered vulgar and uncouth. so that became cursing. essentially, it stems from class oppression.

the above paragraph is second-hand from my old linguistics prof. i haven't researched it on my own...so...yeah.


personally, i stay away from words that have real negative connotations, like cultural slurs and uses of various names of divinity in vain, like g*ddamn. but i have no problem calling someone a f*cking piece of sh*t....assuming, that is, they are a f*cking piece of sh*t