Razz: 8734 vs A236

[RustyBrooks]

The general patterns, or the specific cases?

[disco_stu1978]

It would be neat to see if there was some sort of guidlines to it, same as in hold'em.....

HU, I would feel it is somewhere around 65/35. It's probably why I am not too good at razz though....as played I would assume it is 99/1 and he would get there... [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[Davdob]

Obviously you would need to know dead cards, but my guess is very close to 70/30.

[Wetdog]

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Obviously you would need to know dead cards, but my guess is very close to 70/30.

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Dead cards would be nice, but I put it at 55-45 because of the likelihood of being paired. I'm talking about board cards here, not hole cards.

[RustyBrooks]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Obviously you would need to know dead cards, but my guess is very close to 70/30.

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Dead cards would be nice, but I put it at 55-45 because of the likelihood of being paired. I'm talking about board cards here, not hole cards.

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Huh? I had assumed that the excercise was, there are 2 hands face up on 4th st, what are the odds of A236 one winning.

[Andy B]

That was everyone else's assumption, too.

[Davdob]

I actually read it to be known boards. Not sure why that makes me dumb, since I dont think I would ever know someone else's down cards on 4th street.

In any event, really doesnt make the result different, and obviously if it was a heads up game there would be no dead cards.

[RustyBrooks]

Of course it makes the results different.

xxA246 vs xx8734 is definitely not the same as A246 vs 8734 - unless both people in question will play any 2 down cards.

The quiz is sort of just a checkup. If you put your opponent on a couple of down cards, and you know your cards, can you estimate your equity? I think it was kind of an easy one though.

[Davdob]

Its actually an interesting theoretical question, and the math is above me, but I have to concede you are right that it makes some difference, just not a big one.

Running a simulator xxA246 v. xx8734, shows that xxA246 is a 5% stronger hand versus xx8734 than A246 is v. 8734 if you assume that xx for both players is reasonable (9 or under is what I used, your definition of reasonable of course can vary and it is situational).

If you assume xx is random its essentially the same scenario. I assume that the wider the opponents xx range, the closer you will get to the random result.

[RustyBrooks]

Yep, the tighter you close the range, the more of a favorite xxA236 - even without doing the math it should be apparent why. The difference gets down to about 85:15 if the ranges are 6 and under I think. Anyway, it obviously never approaches 54:45, even with xxA236 vs xx8734, even considering the odds of pairing.