Weird Floor Decision at Wynn

[psandman]

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Problem here is that the player DID NOT ASK for an exact count.

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According to OP, he asked the other player how many bills he had...his opponent answered five. That sounds like a request for an exact count of the bills, and unless the bills were a giant wad that couldn't possibly be five, i don't see how the answer 5 is not a definative answer. If the player said about five you would be correct, but the player answered "5".

[tourney guy]

Trying not to be a nit - he never asks the player to count the money, and never asked the player to count the money on the felt.

I cannot assume it was an angle shot, and it could have been as easy as 2 bills sitcking together on a quick count.

The principle that applies is this - if erroneous (once again, not assuming an angle shot) information is given, and a player acts on that, that is the action.

What if the player said '4', and the stack was actually '5', are you saying the other player is entitled to 5 bills?????????

There is absolutely no way that is true, he would owe '4' if he lost, and thus, only get '4' if he wins.

It seems pretty simple to me.

[psandman]

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Trying not to be a nit - he never asks the player to count the money,

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back to original post

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so I asked him how many bills he had

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That sounds like a request for a count to me. I will agree that in context there may be dispute as to whether the answer was definitive or an estimate and it may be the sort fo thing you had to be there to judge fairly (perhaps the tone of the answer indicatied that it was just a guestimate).

To put the burden on the player asking for the count to make sure the count is actually accurate seems to me to be a ridiculous burden which would bring games to a halt.

Player 1: How many bills do you have back there.
Player 2: I have 8 bills.
Player 1: Can I see you count them.
Player 2: String of obscenities... Here 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8
Player 1: Returning string of obscenities . . I'm sorry I didn't see that, would you kindly mind laying each bill on the felt.

You can just imagine where this discussion is going now repeat everytime a player wants a count.




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What if the player said '4', and the stack was actually '5', are you saying the other player is entitled to 5 bills?????????

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That is precisely what I am saying. I am saying that the player who caused the probelm (by giving the erroneous information) should be the one who takes the worst of it. It sucks to take the worst of it, but one of these two is going to get screwed . . . it seems to me an easy answer to say the guy who is at fault is the one who takes the screwing.

This seems rather simple to me.

[grdred944]

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I think you owe the full 600. Lots of ppl ask other ppl how much they have in a casual fashion. If you wanted a detailed count you should have asked the dealer.

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This is a tough one but I have to disagree with this. The player was asked how many bills he had. Not approximately how many but how many and he said 5. There may be a casual answer but the question was clear as day.

[UbinTook]

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I think you owe the full 600. Lots of ppl ask other ppl how much they have in a casual fashion. If you wanted a detailed count you should have asked the dealer.

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This is a tough one but I have to disagree with this. The player was asked how many bills he had. Not approximately how many but how many and he said 5. There may be a casual answer but the question was clear as day.

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Agreed, was asked specifically and he answered specifically. Had he answered "about 5" and he wasn't pressed for a more accurate count then the 600 is in play.