UFC 59 Odds are up - My bets in here:

[Tuds75]

I just watched Tito/Forrest and Tito won the fight. Tito took round 1, Forrest won round 2, and Tito took round 3. The punches Tito landed had a greater effect then Forrest's punches. And the elbows from Forrest on his back are not scoring shots. The first round was not a perfect example of 10-8 round. Forrest was dominated, but he fought back and that is the key. He actually got up from the opening take down by Tito and then tried to land a few punches and I think he connected on a couple, causing little damamge, but it shows Forrest was trying fighting back and scoring. A perfect example of an 10-8 round is the 2nd or 3rd round (i can't remember) of Franklin/Louiseau at UFC 58. Frankling almost KO'ed the Crow and couldn't quite finish him and the Crow spent the whole round running and holding just trying to survive. Louseau never even attempted any offense. That is what 10-8 rounds are for. Without a point ""deduction" from a knockdown like you get in boxing the requirements for a 10-8 round in MMA competition is a very gray zone, but then again round scoring in MMA as evident in the last few UFC PPV is not very defined.

I heard on sherdog an interview with Dana White that Tito is OUT for the Shamrock fight, but the good news is that Forrest has stepped up to fight Ken. It sounds like Tito might be done with the UFC again (we all know that he and Dana don't have any love lose). Dana also mentioned that the next PPV after Hughes/Gracie would have the rematch of Silvia/Arlovski and I think Forrest/Shamrock.

Tuds

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I heard on sherdog an interview with Dana White that Tito is OUT for the Shamrock fight, but the good news is that Forrest has stepped up to fight Ken. It sounds like Tito might be done with the UFC again (we all know that he and Dana don't have any love lose). Dana also mentioned that the next PPV after Hughes/Gracie would have the rematch of Silvia/Arlovski and I think Forrest/Shamrock.


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Tuds - can you post a link? I can't find the interview...

[Tuds75]

Sherdog is really mixed-up/confussing these days. This was the lead story on mma weekly yesterday.

http://www.mmaweekly.com/absolutenm/...&zoneid=13

Tuds

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Thanks a bunch for the link.

From the article:

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The UFC President also said that he scored Forrest as the winner when Griffin fought Ortiz. Zuffa CEO Lorenzo Fertitta scored it a draw with Forrest winning rounds two and three and Tito winning the first round 10-8. White was also critical of the judging saying judge Abe Balardo should never score another MMA fight again as he scored that fight 30-27 for Ortiz.

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Interesting to see. Couldn't agree more with the assesment of Abe Balardo.

As we've noted in the last couple UFCs, MMA judging has a long way to go to even catch up with Boxing (which isn't saying much as far as a goal). Hopefully this slight admision by Dana that the judging was pretty bad there will warrant some sort of action on this front.

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Does the UFC scoring system allow for draws?

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Yes. http://www.ufc.tv/index.cfm?fa=LearnUFC.Rules#section4

They are infrequent, however.

IIRC, the last two were Vernon White vs Ian Freeman in UFC 43 and B.J. Penn vs Caol Uno in UFC 41.

[obsidian]

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Thanks a bunch for the link.

From the article:

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The UFC President also said that he scored Forrest as the winner when Griffin fought Ortiz. Zuffa CEO Lorenzo Fertitta scored it a draw with Forrest winning rounds two and three and Tito winning the first round 10-8. White was also critical of the judging saying judge Abe Balardo should never score another MMA fight again as he scored that fight 30-27 for Ortiz.

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Interesting to see. Couldn't agree more with the assesment of Abe Balardo.

As we've noted in the last couple UFCs, MMA judging has a long way to go to even catch up with Boxing (which isn't saying much as far as a goal). Hopefully this slight admision by Dana that the judging was pretty bad there will warrant some sort of action on this front.

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Yea, when they announced the 30-27 scoring that was just wrong. However, I do think Tito won this fight. It really comes down to the 3rd round which Tito edged out a win in thanks to some decent connecting punches and a takedown. Also, Tito dominated the 1st round much more than Forrest did the 2nd.

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Since its been slow in here lately, I don't feel bad about bumping this thread with a new opinion. This is from Matt Hughes, writing for Sherdog.com (a subscribers only article, if you like MMA I suggest you strongly consider subscribing to their members section)

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Controversy in Ortiz-Griffin

The controversy of the night came in the co-main event: Tito Ortiz (Pictures) vs. Forrest Griffin (Pictures).

I said beforehand this is a win-win for Forrest and I believe he outdid even my expectations in that regard. This was a great fight, as is every fight I’ve seen Forrest compete in. He has a very rare competitive spirit.

Tito Ortiz (Pictures) has matured some. His normal mouthy bashing of his opponents did not occur this time. Although he was still brash and edgy, he gave Forrest props and built him up as an opponent. A much wiser proposition.

You really look like a dumb ass if you tear someone down and then they go out and beat you! Tito looked like the Tito of old, at least for the first round. He manhandled Forrest in typical ground-and-pound fashion, and I felt “Big” John McCarthy was looking very closely at the cuts and the action on more than one occasion during the round.

You could make a case for a 10-8 round for Tito in my opinion. This was worst-case scenario for Forrest and the type of onslaught we spent a lot of time preparing him to be ready to deal with.

Forrest is a notorious slow starter and Tito is just that good when he’s on. Not a good round for Griffin. Now I’m not sure when Tito hurt his knee, but it was apparent to me his legs were gone in the second round.

The normally spry and well-conditioned Tito was having trouble with his wheels. It was either the inability to train due to the injury that left Tito flat or, more likely, Tito’s propensity for over-training that caused the injury and the subsequent lack of gas in the tank.

I felt the second round most definitely went to Forrest, 10-9. I have no idea what fight judge Abe Bellardo was watching to score a 30-27. Did I say that out loud?

The third round was a very, very close one and probably the period that determined the fight. Forrest still looked to be the fresher fighter. Tito, however, with true champion spirit, was not about to lie down.

As I evaluated the round, Tito landed clean punching combinations and scored the takedown with a minute left. Although he was in the dominant position, Forrest landed more and better shots from the bottom. He then scrambled up and finished the round on his feet.

I felt Forrest still carried the round with a 10-9, which would make the fight a draw.

I, however, am a little biased toward Forrest and was not shocked by the decision for Tito. Forrest is a fantastic fighter and, more important, a wonderful person. Despite Tito’s post-fight comments, I still like Tito and respect his ability to compete. I hope he figures out how to peak for a fight and I wish him a speedy recovery.

He was right about one thing he said after the fight. He’s back and he’s going to be a force in the weight class.



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http://www.sherdog.com/news/news.asp?n_id=4402

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And while we're on the subject, Zuffa has launched a new in-depth multimedia site for UFC 60: http://60.ufc.com/

The fight card for 60 is starting to solidify. A pretty weak card overall, obviously Dana believes that the strength of Hughes / Gracie can carry this PPV on its own. And judging by the ticket sales so far, they're right in this as usual.

Announced bouts:

Matt Hughes Vs. Royce Gracie
Brandon Vera Vs. Assuerio Silva
Mike Swick Vs. Joe Riggs
Diego Sanchez Vs. John Alessio
Melvin Guillard Vs. Rick Davis
Spencer Fisher Vs. Leonard Garcia